alpina??

[m3f_///sleeper_f29d08a5a4]

So Alpina isn't a manufacturer in the sence of say, Ruf to Porsche, right? They're more of a tuner/customizer. Also, why is it that Alpina doesn't, or can't, use BMW M-motors for their cars. That would be a much better platform to start doing some serious tuning off of...imagine an Alpina edition M3.



The only problem I have with the Tip-tronic, Step-tronic, whatever transmission is the fact that the computer still has the ultimate say in the shifting (All I've driven is the Audi version of this tranny)...For instance, if you run it up to redline the computer will shift the car for you and the shift itself still feals automatic; you know, the revs drop down and match the gearing and what-not. I agree though that these cars (Alpina Z8's) are not built for the track...their slushboxes make it easier for even the most yuppie of owners to big-pimp it in their fast car.

[m3f_astan100_7ef66fbe89]

Sfoster- SMG is a totally different beast from the slushbox in the Alpina. Perhaps YOU should "start reading". It is actually a manual tranny that happens to be shifted via hydraulics blah blah blah....the point is, it's actually a manual minus the clutch. It even shifts much faster than the average human can. The Alpina is still going to have the torque converter etc and I bet I can outshift it.



At the power levels we're talking, the acceleration isn't a big difference, but I'm just saying that auto's in a car of this level is just sad to me.



My e36 is a POS compared to 130k cars, but at least it is an enthusiast's car and not something designed for yuppies. Maybe enthusiast yuppies...but still enthusiasts.

[m3f_Drifter_23d8df4bc6]

Sfoster, calm down. we all have to lose some day, and well..... GAME OVER!!!!



the Z8 i find is only a show car seeing that it looks like it should be sold in 2017, its whole I got v8 power is crap when mmmm lets think it 1) is over 130K for it 2) no man would drive this car like mad when costing 130K 3) mostly older people who have been saving can buy this car.



Oh and SMG is a manual tanny but the clutch is controlled by a computer. But cool thing is that it can shift in .5 secs or less i can't remember the number. + that you can't miss shift. only prob you can't do clutch drops.



And I think you just lost for fighting a Mod.



Oh and I was trying to be nice when saying this.

[m3f_Sirius_880bd69485]

I agree. If I had the money for a Z8, more or less the alpina, I sure as hell wouldn't get an automattic. Fuk that.

[m3f_sfoster_f5bf245797]

lost what? you may not like it, but that doesn't make the car a POS now does it? a statement like that is what sets me off and leads me to believe you have no idea what you are talking about.

[m3f_E36Pilot]

So Alpina isn't a manufacturer in the sence of say, Ruf to Porsche, right? They're more of a tuner/customizer. Also, why is it that Alpina doesn't, or can't, use BMW M-motors for their cars.



Actually, comparing Alpina:BMW to Ruf:Porsche is the perfect comparison. Alpina is a manufacturer in exactly the same sense as Ruf. They take normal BMWs, strip them down and build them again with their parts. The result is an Alpina with a new Alpina VIN number, not a BMW. Like Ruf, it's also possible to purchase individual parts and have them installed much like a normal tuner.



Alpina doesn't use M engines because they are marketing cars to compete with BMW M. BMW basically takes their engines and modifies them into M guise. Similarily, Alpina takes normal BMW engines and enhances them to their liking. Often times M engines are engineered to their output capacity (such as the m5 S62). By starting off with a normal BMW engine, Alpina has more room to tune.

[m3f_Viking]

Sfoster-



The Alpina is still going to have the torque converter etc and I bet I can outshift it.







Have you ever tryed an ALPINA with their Schift tronic system ? I have and even if I wold never consider an Autobox in a fast car, I was really impressed by this.



I drove both the B3 3.3 and the B10S



In sport mode it does hold it gears like an manual, change up hard and precis, as fast as or almost as fast as SMG but without loosing momentum during gear change.

The only thing I did not like was the downshift, it could have been even more quick.



You shift gear using buttons on the steering wheel.



Truly amazing cars....from an fantastic car manufactor.

[m3f_astan100_7ef66fbe89]

I'd love to try out an Alpina, but the problem is that we ONLY have their Z8 over here and the chance of test driving one of those things is like 0.00%.



Interesting about the gearbox though.

[m3f_Viking]

They specialize in turbocharging, engine conversions and interiors. Some of their most noteworthy cars are the Alpina 2002 turbo (an alpina version of the 2002 turbo), the B10 (an e34 body with a bi-turbo 6 cyl) and for us e36 fans... the B8 (an e36 with a 4.6L V8 available in sedan, coupe, cabrio and touring).







It has been several years since ALPINA was doing TURBO convertions. The B10 Bi Turbo ended in 03/94. Since then it has only been the D10 BiTurbo based on the 530 Diesel.

Now they have startet to work with forced induction engines again, latest the B7 with 500 Hp and mounted in the 7 series. To follow is the B5, 500 Hp in the 5 series. It will give the new M5 a good run for its money.



Inbetween they have been working with normal aspirated engines like the both I6, V8 and V12 engines.



The ALPINA 2002 TURBO has never existed outside the race track if. They however made a 2002 TURBO killer with the A2 and A4 engines. in the 2002 body.

[m3f_Predator_7d824d33ea]

I'm from Leicester in England and the dealership, Sytners, i'm sure of this is the only place in Europe apart from Germany where ALPINAs are actually built.



I see a heap load of Alpinas all the time and i have to say they r sweet. I think i like them mainly for their exclusitvity, as every rep/high exec. seems to have a E46 M3 and evry boy has a E36 316/318/320 dressed like a M3, and when you see an Alpina it really stands out to those in the know. Also their styling cues are really subtle unlike the M3 or M5.



The reason y i think most Alpinas are automatic is due to the owners who seem to be shall we say, a little bit mature.



I cant believe u only get the Z8 Alpina in America, have u guys seen the new Alpina B7? that really is 1 mad car.



the reason Alpina's tend not to be as fast as their ///M rivals is due to a mutual agreement between the two companies.

[m3f_Viking]

Actually, comparing Alpina:BMW to Ruf:Porsche is the perfect comparison. Alpina is a manufacturer in exactly the same sense as Ruf. They take normal BMWs, strip them down and build them again with their parts. The result is an Alpina with a new Alpina VIN number, not a BMW. Like Ruf, it's also possible to purchase individual parts and have them installed much like a normal tuner.







That only goes for part like rims, suspension and small stuff. You need to be on very good speaking terms to get then to build you a car based on you old one. they will not sell you an engine either.









Alpina doesn't use M engines because they are marketing cars to compete with



NO, They do NOT want to compete with BMW M, its exactly the opsite.



BMW M marked their car as the sportive alternative, while ALPINA goes for the elegant, luxurious and still fast as hell kind of style.









. BMW basically takes their engines and modifies them into M guise.





The only thing an M engine has in common with a normal BMW engine is the number of cylinders.











Often times M engines are engineered to their output capacity (such as the m5 S62). By starting off with a normal BMW engine, Alpina has more room to tune.



Thrue, and I also belive that ALPINA is not aloved to modify the M models at all.

The only M car they ever have modified is the E30 M3.

They installed the big 254 Hp 3,5 liter from the B6 3,5 and called the car B6 3,5S.

Very limited production with only 62 cars produced and a very competent car.

[m3f_Viking]

The reason y i think most Alpinas are automatic is due to the owners who seem to be shall we say, a little bit mature.





That is not alway the case, at the age of 64 my dad still enjoys to pull the old B7 out of the garage, turn the boost to max and just have fun.









I cant believe u only get the Z8 Alpina in America, have u guys seen the new Alpina B7? that really is 1 mad car.







Thats only because Americans cant handle a stic They do want an autmatic, as simple as that. So ALPINA builds one for them....















the reason Alpina's tend not to be as fast as their ///M rivals is due to a mutual agreement between the two companies.



That have been correct ( almost) for a while but it has not been that for ever.



The ALPINA E12-E24-E28 B7 versions totaly raped the M5 version all the way from E12 until E34. It was not even close.



The B7 will humiliate any M5 version made and even follow the E39 M5 to the door.



The ALPINA B8 will also outrun the E36 M3, and totaly destroy any US version of the M3 exept the new E46 M3.

Owners of the B8 claim to have run away from or stayed with E46 M3.

In several races against the E39 M5 they go neck and neck all the way.



My old E34 ALPINA BiTurbo manged to pass 193 mph on the tacho with more to go. ( a bit optimistic I know, but still so much faster than the E34 M5 that is was funny)



The ALPINA B12 5,7 Coupe went well passed 200 mph ( also optimistic but a lot faster than a 850csi will manage that stop at app 180-185 mph in reall speed.



Also the huge B12 6.0 based in the E38 will do close to 186 mph and stay with the M5 in topspeed.



Even the old ALPINA E32 went 175 mph

Today the ALPINA B3 3,4 will stay with the E46 M3 all the way.



BTW: Since all BMW`s since 1988 has been restricted to 155 mph hour and ALPINA`s are not, you have to visit a tuner that can remove the limiter on your BMW to avioid total humiliation on the Autobahn....

[m3f_Predator_7d824d33ea]

cheers for the wealth of knowledge about Alpina, Viking :thumbsup:



did u know Alpina is known more for their wine making ?

[m3f_E36Pilot]

That only goes for part like rims, suspension and small stuff. You need to be on very good speaking terms to get then to build you a car based on you old one. they will not sell you an engine either.



It's a little different for us here in the US. Mostly only Ruf wheels, body pieces, and other little bits are available in the US through aftermarket parts shops. Engines and such are not available. Similarly, Alpina wheels, body peices, decals, etc. are available in the US through a distributer named KSK Distributing.







NO, They do NOT want to compete with BMW M, its exactly the opsite.



BMW M marked their car as the sportive alternative, while ALPINA goes for the elegant, luxurious and still fast as hell kind of style.



Perhaps I didn't explain myself clearly. I meant to say that Alpina competes with BMW M in terms of general, high-end car sales. They both share the same target market (customers looking for a more specialized BMW) but are geared toward two distinct segments of that exclusive car market. Like you said, M leans toward performance and Alpina satisfies the more luxurious sporty segment.

[m3f_00poop6x_6dca3456a4]

I've been meaning to learn how to read...



What's your deal? I'm just saying that if you're going to drop 130k on a sports car, then why are you taking the sport out of the car. This is far beyond an SMG vs. manual argument, this is a straight up poser car...PERIOD. Regular Z8's are cool and all ( I wouldn't get one), but this car is just for show.



I'd love to "start reading", but you'd have to tell me what to read that could provide me with the same brillant insights that you're sharing now...wait, you didn't make a single point.



I guess that you're assuming I've made 2700 useless posts then?



I've never said anything to offend you in the past and I've seen you here for a long time. I rarely ever post something inflammatory, so why are you jumping down my throat now?



Hey! My car is an automatic! poser? :antismili



Taking the sport out of sports car!?!?!? So that means my 4 doors make it even worse!! Agh! hehe, that's why we have Sport mode on the transmission.



Common Allen, the auto isn't that bad. But I'd rather have stick if I wasn't in Houston's 1960. Just more fun.



BTW, if a manual is a gearbox with a manually-operated clutch, and an SMG is a gearbox with a hydraulic autoclutch, then what's an automatic? A gearbox only? What is getting auto'ed? Just wondering.



I need to start reading, just ordered Hooked on Phonics yesterday.



*EDIT* not 'common' but 'come on'