Replacing rubber steering joint with E34 u-joint?

[m3f_cmcon98_d61dd8ea87]

So I'm rebuilding my steering column with new joints and bushings, etc. I've heard of people replacing the rubber lower steering column joint with a metal universal joint from an E34 5-series. Has anyone done this, and is there any noticeable improvement in steering feel from a new rubber joint?



Thanks for any help!

[m3f_scoobiedoo_9bf48826bc]

feels great, best thing i did to my steering

[m3f_aeronaut_a45ef47b73]

^ No kidding? I've read mixed reviews on this mod. Any down side?

[m3f_pbonsalb_ba5494e5cb]

When I looked into this, I noticed the E34 uses some rubber up at the top of the column. I also notice that shops making a poly lower coupling for the E36 recommended against street use. I bought a new stock shaft and coupling. I am sure anything is better than a sign out shaft and torn up or oil soaked coupling.

[m3f_Braymond14_63960d99c1]

I'm curious how effective the poly replacement would be regardless of application. My rubber giubo is already under uneven flex. It isn't a true straight shot from the upper joint to the rack splines.

[m3f_aeronaut_a45ef47b73]

^ This is why I haven't done anything yet. That and there's no slack in my steering, so can be patient.

[m3f_EricSMG_87c5092dff]

I'm curious how effective the poly replacement would be regardless of application. My rubber giubo is already under uneven flex. It isn't a true straight shot from the upper joint to the rack splines.



I can't see using a material that has proven to fail catastrophically in such a critical position.



Rubber degrades very slowly and is very tough. Poly is brittle and breaks apart.



And besides, what's there to improve, exactly? The steering feel/response is fantastic in these cars.

[m3f_scoobiedoo_9bf48826bc]

every real sports car ive drivin has a solid steering linkage, this mod made it feel like a real sports car an not a mushy modern bmw, feels more like the 911 or the etype then a honda


accurracy is improved feedback is more direct but not harsh no impact to the colapsable column, an a part designed when bmws didnt break.


there is aslo some flex in this joint, i dont want it solid an senting all that force onto the upperjoint with a replacment bushing

[m3f_EricSMG_87c5092dff]

I would never call an E36/46/90 steering mushy. It's precise, responsive and refined.



I suspect the u-joint increases (not improves) directness while reducing refinement. Different strokes I guess.



But poly? Hell no.

[m3f_cmcon98_d61dd8ea87]

Thanks for the responses. I'm leaning toward just replacing the rubber joint with a new one now. Even my old Triumph TR6, which has steering that's about as direct as you can get, has a rubber joint much like the E36 one.

[m3f_scoobiedoo_9bf48826bc]

I would never call an E36/46/90 steering mushy. It's precise, responsive and refined.


I suspect the u-joint increases (not improves) directness while reducing refinement. Different strokes I guess.


But poly? Hell no.


refined is a great word to use here, but the change in "refinement" is not all that dramatic at all. what does change is directness and feedback, and the feedback isnt harsh at all just things are noticeable rather then not making any noticeable feedback. and this is what i was missing out of my m3 over my other cars and the cars i work on. because i wanted a 4 door sports car, not e28 #4. and the e36 in stock form was a lateral shift from a euro e28 m535i to me. now after this and a z3 rack and camber plates and dinan suspension and some other odds and ends im incredibly happy. and my m3 puts a bigger smile on my face then it ever has. and this is what i wanted out of my m3 was something that reminds me of a real sport car and not a german sedan, ive moved onto big British sedans with rear tray tables and air conditioned seats for my refinement. but i still have put over 100k miles on my e36 in 4 years and cannot tolerate and rough car, nor can my passengers of old people

[m3f_Braymond14_63960d99c1]

I can't see using a material that has proven to fail catastrophically in such a critical position.


Rubber degrades very slowly and is very tough. Poly is brittle and breaks apart.


And besides, what's there to improve, exactly? The steering feel/response is fantastic in these cars.


I never said anything about using poly, nor would I. I would NOT categorize the E36 steering as being fantastic by any means. If it were I would have a telescoping wheel and no need to swap racks.


The ZCP has FANTASTIC steering.


I still want to know how poly, or metal overcome the fact that the shaft isn't a straight shot to the rack (after the first u-joint).

[m3f_EricSMG_87c5092dff]

I never said anything about using poly, nor would I. I would NOT categorize the E36 steering as being fantastic by any means. If it were I would have a telescoping wheel and no need to swap racks.



The ZCP has FANTASTIC steering.



I still want to know how poly, or metal overcome the fact that the shaft isn't a straight shot to the rack (after the first u-joint).



Gotcha. I guess we're agreeing on the poly thing. I thought you were considering it based on your question, is all. But yeah, can't see it working in a perpetually 'stressed' application.



In terms of the steering overall, we're talking about different things. Ratio and steering wheel position have little/no affect on the actual steering feel (feedback, directness and refinement). In those terms the E36 is amazing, as are the E46 and E90 cars. What I'm saying is that removing a critical point of isolation may increase the feedback and directness but not necessarily improve the overall steering feel as I find the factory balance to be excellent.



But yes, the E46 M3 does have fantastic steering, and, a telescoping wheel The ZCP increases the ratio (unnecessary, IMO) but does increase the steering weight (this is the real improvement, IMO).

[m3f_fiveightan_7e37700daf]

The E36 steering, IMO, is one of the few places the car could really use some help. The rack is slow and it just doesn't have the greatest feel overall. You can dress it up with different couplers to change that aspect of things, but it's still going to have that pickup truck rack in it.


Personally, I replaced my coupler with a new OE rubber one and there was a noticeable improvement in the steering feel. At 140K, mine looked like it was ready to come out. The bushings in it were deformed and softened up. The new one was nice and straight and the rubber allows less flex. It took a little slop out of the initial steering bite and make things feel more solid overall.


Quick tips if you're going to replace the coupler:

-Use a punch or a scribe to mark the position on both ends. What I did was scribe out one of the valleys in the splines, right where the open half of the coupler clamp sits. I did that at the top and the bottom.

-Don't even bother trying to keep the wheel and the rack straight. Just don't turn them more than a turn in either direction, and you'll be fine. You can obviously tell if the wheels/steering wheel are straight. You do NOT want the steering wheel to be a turn off, so don't turn it more than necessary and just return the marked position back when you put it back together...match your scribe marks up. Do this with the front wheels off the ground. It's much easier to get at the nuts if you can rotate things.

-I wedged a washer or 2 in each of the clamp openings to pry them apart a bit and make it easier to slide the coupler off. A little tap with a hammer and it will slide right off. Don't try and fight with it while it's clamping down on the splines.

-The coupler is NOT symmetrical. Mark the position of the old one before you take it off, so you can install the new one in the correct orientation.