Ohlins R&T Spring/Sway Choice

[SQ13]

Fair points. I've set my car up to be driven at the track, and having good precision and feedback for track use are important to me. This car isn't my daily anymore, so I don't mind the slightly firmer ride vs the PSS10 + TMS plate + OE FCAB setup.

I will say that all of the setups with the OE FCABs were totally fine. But when comparing with TMS FCABs they're just softer/more compliant/less precise. And you could probably expect that when comparing rubber with spherical parts. The biggest downside for me was how slow the steering seemed to respond to minor steering inputs when driving at highway speeds---could be an alignment issue even though I asked for 0.0* toe.

No opinions on TMS vs Vorshlag plates. I think they're both good and could go with either one.

[Tbonem3]

No update as it was a one time thing plus it's been several years now, but I hated the feeling going to spherical. It didn't feel like a BMW.

Looks like SQ13 is referring to going back to oe fcabs not the camber plates/ strut mounts I was, earlier.

That said, who knows what variable(s) is responsible or how each person describes a feeling. Imo, oe fcabs are the greatest thing on God's green earth. His feeling is valid, but his baseline was not stock, so ofc stock parts will be softer feeling.

We've had a problem forever where most discuss chassis, for example, but don't qualify their opinion with the intended use, driving style, but also who they are - a petrolhead? Racer? Nerd? Just want bmw for status/cache/cool factor? Care about old school or new school tech or n/a vs. turbo? Everybody's different, and their goals for the car slightly different even though we all like csl boot, coils, airbox, headers tune

I always speak from the heart, but what I care about might not matter to someone else, so it's only one perspective.

[SQ13]

Lol so the opposite of Tbone and I! Interesting...

Yah it’s odd, but there could be other setup differences like alignment. I like to run 0.0° toe up front.
PSS10 + TMS street plates + TMS FCABs - fine, a little less road feedback vs Vorshlag
MCS 2WNR + Vorshlag plates + TMS FCABs - fine
Ohlins R&T + Vorshlag plates + TMS FCABs - fine
Ohlins R&T + Vorshlag plates + OE FCABs - immediately noticed spongy steering feel.

My other M3 had PSS10s with TMS street plates and OE FCABs, and there was less direct feedback/more spongy feeling.

This is my feedback after driving both cars on both the street and track. Take that as you will. I don’t really have anything else to add.

[bavarian3]

Tbonem3 documented the same thing in his build journal about the vorschalg camber plates ruining the steering feel of the car bavarian3 - see below:

Thanks for relaying this. Curious to hear any updated thoughts Tbonem3

Nope, no change in numbness for me. What did make the steering feel floaty was going from TMS spherical to OE rubber, so I’ll prob end up switching back to TMS at some point.

Lol so the opposite of Tbone and I! Interesting...

[SQ13]

Curious about something else. I recently installed my vorshlag plates. I kinda feel like the steering now is a bit.. numb? Almost floaty feeling. Curious if you had similar sentiment vs OE strut mounts.

One of the reasons I installed camber plates was in search for more steering feel. I'm an e36 m3 guy so I've been missing this aspect.

Nope, no change in numbness for me. What did make the steering feel floaty was going from TMS spherical to OE rubber, so I’ll prob end up switching back to TMS at some point.

[AWE46M3]

Tbonem3 documented the same thing in his build journal about the vorschalg camber plates ruining the steering feel of the car bavarian3 - see below:

Did a canyon run a few days after the suspension changes, and really disliked the lifeless steering feel I was getting. It reminded me of when I tried the TMS monoball FCABs. I figured it was the spherical camber plates. I was very happy with the previous TMS plates (poly bush), so I bought another set ("street") and sold the Vorshlags to a friend.

You can see the much larger footprint of the TMS. Despite the disparity in size, the TMS are no heavier than the vorshlags, luckily. Gonna miss the vorshlags, they really really nice and well made.



The TMS plates are quite a bit more expensive than other options. Worse still, they don't come with the necessary upper thrust bearing. Turner gives you the option of buying them, but they word it as "perches." Well, I didn't think I needed it because I didn't want stock perches - I'm using 60mm springs. Turns out the BMW part is a combo, it's the black metal spring perch WITH the yellow/black bearing.

So I ordered a new set of perches/bearing for $40



I hadn't gotten an alignment yet, so no biggie dropping the other plates and putting the TMS in



Not quite as pretty as the gold and red of the vorshalgs And the plates' studs are unnecessarily long.



All done. Hopefully, this is the only change I need to make to be all set and then get an alignment.



Happy to report, the car feels great again. I've got the spherical RSMs and bottom shock attachment, but they don't ruin any perception in "feel." I'm all about the feel and the sound aka the "experience"

[bavarian3]

Nope bc my car has been broken since March. It felt and handled fine before the collision, and my opinion on the setup hasn’t changed. I can take a photo of the adjuster next week. Running the 3DM strut spacer btw.

Curious about something else. I recently installed my vorshlag plates. I kinda feel like the steering now is a bit.. numb? Almost floaty feeling. Curious if you had similar sentiment vs OE strut mounts.

One of the reasons I installed camber plates was in search for more steering feel. I'm an e36 m3 guy so I've been missing this aspect.

[SQ13]

SQ13 any updated feedback on this setup? considering going to this spring for my Ohlins RT with Vorshlag plates. How much preload do you have adjuster moved up?

Nope bc my car has been broken since March. It felt and handled fine before the collision, and my opinion on the setup hasn’t changed. I can take a photo of the adjuster next week. Running the 3DM strut spacer btw.

[Grke46m3]

Depends on rate, but I currently have an 8" 390'ish lb swift spring in the front(with vorshlags) and do not need the strut spacers, not even close.

My plan is to go with turner plates. I would rather go with a 8 inch 343 pound front spring and no spacer if that would work? Vs a 7 inch with a strut spacer and potentially have some spring bind. Am I wrong in my thinking?


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[bavarian3]

Second this! Everyone tells me the 8 inch is too tall and won't be able to lower the car much.


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Depends on rate, but I currently have an 8" 390'ish lb swift spring in the front(with vorshlags) and do not need the strut spacers, not even close.

[Grke46m3]

SQ13 any updated feedback on this setup? considering going to this spring for my Ohlins RT with Vorshlag plates. How much preload do you have adjuster moved up?

Second this! Everyone tells me the 8 inch is too tall and won't be able to lower the car much.


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[bavarian3]

Photos of the car at 13.5”F and 13.0”R (left side 1/16 to 1/8” higher to account for 160ish lb driver). Springs are 336 lb/in 8” Swift springs up front and stock Ohlins 628 lb/in springs in the rear. I may end up raising the car 1/4” on all four corners.

As far as ride quality and comfort goes, it feels much better than my old MCS 2WNR setup on the street with 600/700 and 400/700 springs. While it does handle larger road imperfections well, don’t expect it to feel like an SUV. It does feel a tad more firm than my other M3 with PSS10s, but that car has 550 lb/in rear springs and OE RTABs and FCABs. The silver car has TMS spherical RTABs and FCABs. One issue I have is that at parking lot speeds, the front end is clunky going over road imperfections. This was also present when I had the MCS setup, so I suspect the noise is coming from the FCABs, which I will probably replace with OEM.

SQ13 any updated feedback on this setup? considering going to this spring for my Ohlins RT with Vorshlag plates. How much preload do you have adjuster moved up?

[nuc1]

400 in the rear? True coilover conversion? If not (if typical divorced setup) way too low, I'd run the stock ohlins 628lb spring or go up to like 650. I run 343/628 albeit on MCS, and I love it.

I'd also use rubber RSMS (RE or TCK) or spherical, but not poly if possible. For a track car, I'd use Vorshalg front plates, but for a street car, I hated the way it felt when I tried vorshlag spherical and went right back to TMS street and was happy again. It had a dead feeling and a little more NVH. You're already introducing some NVH with even the street plates from TMS and GC.

I believe ohlins are set up to use factory parts like the top mounts and end links. With a rate almost triple that of stock (143->343), I would wait on the bigger bar as it will likely just introduce understeer unless you're really moving, but since it's a street car, I'd wait and see how the front end responds - you want/need some roll esp if you're running skinny stock wheels/tires that already cause understeer.

Typed that wrong - going with the included 628 lb/in rear spring.
I currently have 20 year old GC camber plates so maybe these will be a step up.
Appreciate all the feedback.

Mike

[Tbonem3]

400 in the rear? True coilover conversion? If not (if typical divorced setup) way too low, I'd run the stock ohlins 628lb spring or go up to like 650. I run 343/628 albeit on MCS, and I love it.

I'd also use rubber RSMS (RE or TCK) or spherical, but not poly if possible. For a track car, I'd use Vorshalg front plates, but for a street car, I hated the way it felt when I tried vorshlag spherical and went right back to TMS street and was happy again. It had a dead feeling and a little more NVH. You're already introducing some NVH with even the street plates from TMS and GC.

I believe ohlins are set up to use factory parts like the top mounts and end links. With a rate almost triple that of stock (143->343), I would wait on the bigger bar as it will likely just introduce understeer unless you're really moving, but since it's a street car, I'd wait and see how the front end responds - you want/need some roll esp if you're running skinny stock wheels/tires that already cause understeer.

[nuc1]

Bumping this thread as I'm looking to purchase the Ohlins RT setup through Barry at 3DM. My car will be 95% street driven on somewhat crappy Central VA roads. Typically run OE 19s (15 mm spaacers on the front) but have a set of OE square 18s I use on the track. Here's where I'm at:
Ohlins RT 3DM Trackday Option 1
Front Spring: 343 lb/in (lower based on discussions here at nam3forum)
Rear Spring: 400 lb/in
Vorshlag adjustable camber plates
3DM spacers
Urethane rear upper shock mounts

Ride height:
Front: 13.5 or a bit higher
Rear: 13 or a bit higher

Sways: stock for now

Do I need aftermarket sway end links to work w/ stock?
Bite the bullet and get an aftermarket front sway? GC? Turner? CSL? Hotchkis appears to be NLA
Should I use RE rear shock mounts?

I've read just about every thread here and reached out to a few members for their thoughts. Looking for any input before making the purchase. I'm looking to "set it and forget it" and enjoy the ride if at possibe.

Thanks,
Mike