Nightmare dealer situation (Updated)

[sapote]

brand new Crank, rods, piston rings, main and rod bearings.

Wow, I still remember the dealer supervisor said the engine was turned off by the low oil pressure detected by the sensor but then they had to replace all of these parts.
Great job of put up the fight. Good luck with the 'new' engine.

[GreyM340i]

I just wanted to finally update this post from early this year. Well after dropping my M3 off at the dealer July 2nd I just received it a few days ago. They had to do way more than we originally thought however she’s back on the road and driving like new. The work consisted of sending the motor to the machine shop for cleaning and honing then brand new Crank, rods, piston rings, main and rod bearings. Then the head was also sent in to be cleaned and have all new valves installed. Also got them to throw in a brand new clutch for the log wait. There are 4 pages with parts and documenting everything including the 2 year unlimited mileage warranty. Not that I will be able to drive much here in IL. I’m just happy to have it back in the garage as this could have been such a worst outcome. Thank god they stood behind their mistake.

[GreyM340i]

Dealer got back to me with questions about the top end of the motor and he wrote this back to me. “Yes sir, I actually had BMW engineering out last week and two of their technicians went over it with my tech to make sure it all looks fine. Everything looks good and we are waiting for the engine to return after cleaning. So hopefully everything is ok and the engine runs perfectly.

[Nate047]

Honestly that's a pretty good resolution

[GreyM340i]

The top half of the motor turns half as fast and generally never shows much of an issue when oil starved, even the cam journals that also ride on fluid film bearings. Somewhat surprising. Tthe bottom end always gives way first when there is a total pressure loss and the rod bearings being subject to the greatest direct loads are the first to go.

Thanks for the info. Hopefully thats the case in my situation.

[tlow98]

The top half of the motor turns half as fast and generally never shows much of an issue when oil starved, even the cam journals that also ride on fluid film bearings. Somewhat surprising. Tthe bottom end always gives way first when there is a total pressure loss and the rod bearings being subject to the greatest direct loads are the first to go.

[GreyM340i]

It's pretty easy to see the valve train and cams, just pull the valve cover. If they install new rings then they have to pull the head off so they would be able to inspect all of it. Primary worry would be a flat spotted follower and a damaged cam lobe.

To be fair, they can't nor should they put it in writing that the head and all of the parts in it will last indefinitely. Were they affected? Absolutely if there was a loss in pressure. The question is whether everything is still within spec. They would have to do a valve adjustment when reassembling. If they can get the valve clearance within spec then the only thing left to worry about are the ghosts that exist from this experience.

Yeah don't think its fair to think it will last forever or get them to say that. I just want to be sure that their mistake didn’t damage or put extra wear on the top end of the motor. Its still a 95k mile car so some wear is going to be there even if nothin ever happened. He did say they would inspect it during the tear down of the block. Hopefully I get it back and everything is great so I can finally enjoy the car.

[bigjae46]

It's pretty easy to see the valve train and cams, just pull the valve cover. If they install new rings then they have to pull the head off so they would be able to inspect all of it. Primary worry would be a flat spotted follower and a damaged cam lobe.

To be fair, they can't nor should they put it in writing that the head and all of the parts in it will last indefinitely. Were they affected? Absolutely if there was a loss in pressure. The question is whether everything is still within spec. They would have to do a valve adjustment when reassembling. If they can get the valve clearance within spec then the only thing left to worry about are the ghosts that exist from this experience.

[GreyM340i]

I agree with your conclusion but I don’t think dealer logic is this tight. Dealers don’t think that hard. They just throw parts at the myth of certainty. The only thing worse than Fking up his car is not fixing it by going halfazz. It’s all insurance money at this point anyway (“errors and omissions” — cost of doing business). They don’t want to dip into that pot often, but it IS there. If GreyM340i brings up the bearings, rockers and lobes (which he definitely should), they’ll likely inspect and replace those too. If there were still full engines available new, he might be getting one.

maw

On Monday I will message the manager again to put it in writing that all the components in the head assembly are unaffected. We will see what they say now that its all apart. I’m relying on them to do the right thing and fix their mistake correctly.

[GreyM340i]

Only one rod bearing failed and they have to replace with new crank, main bearing, and piston rings? And the low oil sensor would turn the engine off?
Now it is confirmed that the no oil engine running had damaged the crank, all the bearings and seized up the pistons in cylinder, bad enough to stall the engine. It's fair that they finally agreed to fix the bottom end. But I will be concerned about the top end: cams bearings, rockers, cam lobes. These might not making noise now, but could show up down the road. They should be removed and inspected.

As far as I was told one bearing spun damaging the crank and the others needed replacement as they showed wear. I also did bring up my concerns with the head and they said it didn't show any sign of unusual wear however when they were taking the motor apart they would fully inspect it before reassembly and replace anything that would be needed. I’m also asking for a warranty on this work because I wont be able to put many miles on this new motor before the weather turns here in Illinois. So I want to be sure it’s running perfectly.

[maw1124]

Only one rod bearing failed and they have to replace with new crank, main bearing, and piston rings? And the low oil sensor would turn the engine off?
Now it is confirmed that the no oil engine running had damaged the crank, all the bearings and seized up the pistons in cylinder, bad enough to stall the engine. It's fair that they finally agreed to fix the bottom end. But I will be concerned about the top end: cams bearings, rockers, cam lobes. These might not making noise now, but could show up down the road. They should be removed and inspected.

I agree with your conclusion but I don’t think dealer logic is this tight. Dealers don’t think that hard. They just throw parts at the myth of certainty. The only thing worse than Fking up his car is not fixing it by going halfazz. It’s all insurance money at this point anyway (“errors and omissions” — cost of doing business). They don’t want to dip into that pot often, but it IS there. If GreyM340i brings up the bearings, rockers and lobes (which he definitely should), they’ll likely inspect and replace those too. If there were still full engines available new, he might be getting one.

maw

[sapote]

1. Well on the drive home right before I get off the exit for my house I saw the oil light flash on and the engine died right on the turn. There were cars behind me to I quickly pulled off to the side. I didn’t think anything was wrong so tried to start the car when I heard a crazy noise and the engine ran ruff before I quickly turned it off, I open the hood and smelled oil. Looked under the car and saw a puddle oil and oil coming out the car. My heart sank and I quickly called the service adviser and told him what happened and that I was worried the engine was seized. He said the M3 has a sensor and if the oil is low it will turn the car off.

......

Well after 3 days of them having my car he called me and said they think its from the bottom end of the motor and wanted my permission to open the bottom end up to investigate. I said as long as I’m not paying they had permission. I just wanted the car I purchased to run so I can enjoy my first summer with it. The next week I get a call and he tells me that a rod bearing had failed and they will be ordering me a brand new crank, rod bearings, main bearings, and new piston rings. Said they would take about 3 weeks to get here from Germany. I asked why not just replace the short block and his answer was that they were properly repairing the motor and a short lock wasn't a option. Right now the block is at a machine shop and next week they will be assembling it. I’m happy they stepped up and took care of their mistake however would someone take this as a positive or negative if I ever sell this car? I’m thinking its a positive thats its all new and refreshed with no miles on the bottom end however not sure. What do you guys think? Sorry about the long post. Lol

Only one rod bearing failed and they have to replace with new crank, main bearing, and piston rings? And the low oil sensor would turn the engine off?
Now it is confirmed that the no oil engine running had damaged the crank, all the bearings and seized up the pistons in cylinder, bad enough to stall the engine. It's fair that they finally agreed to fix the bottom end. But I will be concerned about the top end: cams bearings, rockers, cam lobes. These might not making noise now, but could show up down the road. They should be removed and inspected.

[maw1124]

I wouldn’t worry about the value down the road. It’ll be positive. “New factory internals installed by dealer in 2022” erases a lot of years, mileage and worries about how the car was treated before 2022, especially on a car where the chief concern is some idiot beat on it mercilessly, threw a bunch of aftermarket trash on it then sold it.

Dealer error; dealer fix … all to your good.

maw

[GreyM340i]

That is pretty damn impressive considering most dealerships would make up every excuse possible to avoid doing that work.

Yeah I thought I was going to be screwed. I have purchased 3 cars through that dealership and will use them again after they owned up to their mistake and took care of it. I just want to get it back before the weather changes here in Illinois and I have to put it away again.

[cobra]

So I wanted to update my post. Its been a while since this happened January this year. Since then I drove it about 700 miles and had a Blackstone test (attached) done per the deal I made with the BMW dealership. As you can see I was a little concerned about the health of the motor. Also at the same time of the test I mentioned that there was a little rattling sound around 3000 rpm so I thought it was the Vanos. They said lets monitor it and sent me on my way. I wasn't happy with that and didn't feel like it was a normal noise. I parked the car and I emailed the service manager asking them what are they going to do? I asked if I was on my own at this point because they weren’t taking really taking any responsibility for their original mistake. I didn't hear back for a week so I shot off another email asking them to please put it in writing if they were going to help me further or am I on my own. Well after a week I get a response saying he was on vacation and that I wasn't on my own to bring it in so they could investigate what that rattle noise was.

Well after 3 days of them having my car he called me and said they think its from the bottom end of the motor and wanted my permission to open the bottom end up to investigate. I said as long as I’m not paying they had permission. I just wanted the car I purchased to run so I can enjoy my first summer with it. The next week I get a call and he tells me that a rod bearing had failed and they will be ordering me a brand new crank, rod bearings, main bearings, and new piston rings. Said they would take about 3 weeks to get here from Germany. I asked why not just replace the short block and his answer was that they were properly repairing the motor and a short lock wasn't a option. Right now the block is at a machine shop and next week they will be assembling it. I’m happy they stepped up and took care of their mistake however would someone take this as a positive or negative if I ever sell this car? I’m thinking its a positive thats its all new and refreshed with no miles on the bottom end however not sure. What do you guys think? Sorry about the long post. Lol

That is pretty damn impressive considering most dealerships would make up every excuse possible to avoid doing that work.