5 things you like and 5 things you dislike about your m3

[Tbonem3]

because i don't live in a vacuum

Sure? Seem to be lost in space comparing a 20+ year old car to newer ones in a category heavily affected by the passing of time.

says the owner of every vehicle with an unremarkable 0-60mph time

I don't own every car that has an unremarkable 0-60 time. I own 2 cars. Thought you didn't live in a vacuum - now 0-60 matters so much?

has not always been the case

Which M3 has been a drag racer?

^ debatable comment from a guy that thinks there's no debate

Please provide a counter

..

[maw1124]

Just buy an e90 Cris ... Shits all over E36/E46 chassis

The industry agrees ... https://bringatrailer.com/listing/2013-bmw-m3-coupe-37/

maw

[Nate047]

Things I like:

S54 go bzzzzzzzz
Nostalgia vibes
Fairly healthy as far as vices go
Is red
Turns pretty good

Things I don't like:

Buying the "wrong" stuff over and over / second guessing everything
Being paranoid about massive engine or chassis failure
Realizing I should have bought a LCI or at least a MK60 car
Knowing I still can't afford a 911
Overthinking literally everything instead of just enjoying the car because even though it's a giant piece of shit it's still pretty cool

[usdmej]

Why are you comparing performance between a car made in the late 90s to modern (turbo) era?

because i don't live in a vacuum

There's more to a car tha 0-60 times anyway.

says the owner of every vehicle with an unremarkable 0-60mph time

Has always been the case with m3s.

has not always been the case

Only car that competes with E46 m3 is E9x M3 for anywhere near/under $100k.

^ debatable comment from a guy that thinks there's no debate

[SQ13]

Idk how some people think the interior styling is inferior to competitors’ cars. The interiors of Merc, Audi, and Porsche from the same area look disgusting and overdone.

[CrisSilberGrau]

Completely agree. The rear bulkhead is a big miss and is a product of compromise.

I installed an x-brace bar (tying the rear subframe mounts to the shock mounts) and the Vince front cups in my 330i sedan (mostly the same as your brother's ZHP) and it made an unbelievable difference. So much so that the front end now feels weak and sloppy comparison. If you're serious about performance... it's the only way to go. I still get to keep my fold downs, albeit I can't fit wide things anymore. Great for skis, lumber, etc. though!

Oh I'm serious famlees 😎

[tlow98]

The issue here is that the 3 series started all the way back from the great grandfather the 2002, and then the grandfather the E21. Both of those to my knowledge never came in sedan form but only 2 door coupé. The E21 was my introduction to the bmw brand through my dad's first ever car E21 315.

The first ever M3 was only a 2 door coupé. BMW motorsport for the large part has only raced coupés, save for a few notably the E36 GT2 Sedan, and maybe some others. The E30 was a pretty wild creation on top of the regular model.

This particular decision just shows me that even in what i consider to be BMWs absolute hay day the writing was on the wall. It would have benefited the chassis greatly and perhaps is part of the reason why when have particular trouble with the front two subframe points. This wall would go directly over, or as far as makes no difference, to where the Vince bar, yurkancages strut bars bolt in. It's peculiar to say the least.

I drove my brothers ZHP which he hated because it had no fold down seats. But man you could feel the rear end was rock solid. Imo one of the biggest mistakes chassis wise on an otherwise perfect sports car.

Completely agree. The rear bulkhead is a big miss and is a product of compromise.

I installed an x-brace bar (tying the rear subframe mounts to the shock mounts) and the Vince front cups in my 330i sedan (mostly the same as your brother's ZHP) and it made an unbelievable difference. So much so that the front end now feels weak and sloppy comparison. If you're serious about performance... it's the only way to go. I still get to keep my fold downs, albeit I can't fit wide things anymore. Great for skis, lumber, etc. though!

[maw1124]

I was 15 when it came out, it's been a minute.

I hear you. I was 30 years old when these came out and already had an in period SClass and an Audi in the garage by the time I bought one. This leather was always cheaper. I just didn’t think it would wear so much faster. I mean, I’ve used this car less, cared for the leather more, and the leather has worn more. I can’t make that up. When it wears out I’ll just not be beholden to factory leather. Or maybe I will. It’s not a big deal either way.

As far as design, I have zero problems with this car which is why I own it, along with two Bruno Sacco design masterpieces. So yeah design is subjective but over time subjective opinions tend to converge, like they do on the E39M, E46M, etc.

Any you’re also right about the plastic… I’ve replaced light switches and steering wheel buttons and whatever else wears from touch on every car I’ve ever owned. That shit doesn’t even count — it’s like changing oil.

maw

[CrisSilberGrau]

I get it and I agree, except for one point. BMW doesn’t make “sports” cars. They make sedans and sporting cars based on sedans. There in lies the compromise.

I wish they made a true halo sporting car. Sadly they don’t or haven’t since the M1.

The issue here is that the 3 series started all the way back from the great grandfather the 2002, and then the grandfather the E21. Both of those to my knowledge never came in sedan form but only 2 door coupé. The E21 was my introduction to the bmw brand through my dad's first ever car E21 315.

The first ever M3 was only a 2 door coupé. BMW motorsport for the large part has only raced coupés, save for a few notably the E36 GT2 Sedan, and maybe some others. The E30 was a pretty wild creation on top of the regular model.

This particular decision just shows me that even in what i consider to be BMWs absolute hay day the writing was on the wall. It would have benefited the chassis greatly and perhaps is part of the reason why when have particular trouble with the front two subframe points. This wall would go directly over, or as far as makes no difference, to where the Vince bar, yurkancages strut bars bolt in. It's peculiar to say the least.

I drove my brothers ZHP which he hated because it had no fold down seats. But man you could feel the rear end was rock solid. Imo one of the biggest mistakes chassis wise on an otherwise perfect sports car.

[CrisSilberGrau]

Just buy an e90 Cris

Shits all over E36/E46 chassis

I'd love the CRT, but i don't love bankruptcy as much.

[CrisSilberGrau]

Plastic is plastic. It’s the leather that’s the problem. The 996/997 get the same critique from me, except they’re worse. The design AND the execution both suck for a car at that price point. At least this one has price point as an excuse (or mitigating factor if you prefer). For those with cams and tunes, I understand high RPM hp increases, but what 2700RPM torque increase do you get?



That’s because it is the best they ever did.😂. I say this having just put in a new center console and sent the old one out to be covered in Black leather (as opposed to Imola) unless the interior shop is smoking that new crack.

maw

I disagree about the leather part, that's a wearable item, you have your hands on it constantly in the car. Are you saying the steering wheel and shift knob/boot should not wear. The seat after multiple uses to not wear, and more over without proper care which btw is 90% of the use case of these cars. People literally giving zero fucks and doing early 2000s version of TikTok sends on everything with this car. I think we really forget what it must have been like to have this level of car back then new, i was 15 when it came out, it's been a minute.

Design as much as ppl like to argue is not subjective. The over all layout and design of the interior is one with a clear vision and inclination towards the driver and focused to sportive driving characteristics. It's incredibly well done and does not date the car at all. The guage cluster is iconic. So i struggle with your point on design and execution which are both above what most cars in that time period had and has aged way better. In fact all E chassis cars that were in this time period, especially the more savoury M cars and other high spec trims (740M sport/50iL) have outstanding interiors that look amazing today with a clear design ethos that could be traced across the whole BMW line.

Materials and manufacturing tech has come a long way, but for the time this was class leading. And price does factor in this, I'd only be happy in a 996 GT3 OR GT2, those interiors in Porsches transition to new era were/are abhorrent, and even deep into the 997 line. Mercedes had similar plasticity word however their interior design was arguably as bad as Porsche's in period. Literally every single car that bmw made in this time period was class leading by a margin, they were taking a grand total of zero Ls from anyone. I FUKING miss those times, now where selling ... Nah I'm not doing this here.

[Tbonem3]

Just buy an e90 Cris

Shits all over E36/E46 chassis

[CrisSilberGrau]

Slon wants $4600 for their front brace. Not even kidding.

I would be mad at that if they didn't do their due diligence and test it on a rig, which they did. This is a well designed piece and updates the front end to e9x levels.

Whereas their cf wall would have been rendered practically obsolete if bmw served one OEM.

Imagine a car with slon front brace, cf roof and roof bow, and YURKan Cages rear strut bar... In years time i hope to find out.

[Tbonem3]

A C or CLK AMG (55 or 63) might change your mind about that. Might not. But the interior materials might also still be sub par.

maw

Only thing the 63 has for it is exhaust note imo. E90 is the better car.

[01SG]

I wish they made a true halo sporting car. Sadly they don’t or haven’t since the M1.

Unfortunately, there is not much market for those cars from BMW. I saw the stories of the e36 LTW being marked down because nobody would buy them. Hell, they almost did not even bring the e36 m3 to America. They also made a pure sports car with the Z4 M, and nobody bought them.

The Z8 is still a pretty cool halo car, although not in the sense of the M1.