M3 Stablemates: What else do you have in the garage?

[01SG]

My father worked on every iteration of the Esprit for decades. He always maintained the four-cylinder was the one to have and hated the V8-especially working on it.

[Mike RT4]

Thanks for that feedback, I have a M3 Competition (CS in your area, close as we got to CSL) and I've always thought about getting an Esprit V8, we never got many of the S4S here in the states. Wondered what an owner of both would say. Do you think the V8 would make it more competition for the M?

Try one and see what you think. The V8 is heavier at just under 1400kg (just over 3000lbs). My experience having test driven one back in the day (the green press car that was featured in all the magazines at the time), was that it was disappointing. I was expecting it to be leaps ahead of the 4 cylinder cars, but it's torque limited in 1st and 2nd to protect the driveshafts and doesn't even run intercoolers, as the gearbox also can't cope with the torque that more boost would provide in the higher gears once it gets full a boost (a heady 0.8 bar in the right "overboost" conditions), so they didn't bother (and if you see how tight it is with the V8, packaging would also have been an issue). They could have probably achieved the same power if it was NA with higher compression etc. Looks the part, but is all bark and no bite. There is a company in the US (Renegade( that does the LS conversions. They then become the car Lotus should have built:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=92i-H9-FQbE

[maw1124]

Lol. Well I have a 120 mile round trip commute so comfy car and electric is nice there. And the acceleration is utterly ridiculous.

And you can't drain the battery on 120 miles so charging only at home works.

maw

[Bimmerjeff]

The Esprit (being from the 90s and despite the factory Bilstein upgraded dampers) is still more of a GT car. The seats are also nowhere near as supportive as the CSL ones (I'd like to fit some Sport 300 style ones from an Elise or the like). Also, it's only 25kg lighter than the CSL (so not sufficient enough to be faster). It has 30bhp less power, but 60lb ft more torque but only in the mid-range (thanks to the turbo), but it doesn't make this until 4000rpm and then starts to die off from 5000rpm where it is 30lb ft down on the CSL by 7000rpm (due to the turbo sizing). So on the road, the performance is pretty much equal, but on the track, the Esprit would be left WAY behind (it's just too soft and the power is all in the mid-range, where the CSL is the other way round - sharp and hungers for revs).

Obviously a standard S4S would be slower than even a normal M3 - that's almost 10 years of progress for you..... But then no BMW can shoot helicopters out of the sky or go underwater .

The overboost they used to rave about at the time, was just created by a softly sprung wastegate actuator. Once you got to 4600rpm with a wide-open-throttle, the exhaust gasses would just push open the wastegate and the boost would drop off to 0.7 bar LOL. Not exactly sophisticated.

Thanks for that feedback, I have a M3 Competition (CS in your area, close as we got to CSL) and I've always thought about getting an Esprit V8, we never got many of the S4S here in the states. Wondered what an owner of both would say. Do you think the V8 would make it more competition for the M?

[Mike RT4]

Awesome rides! How does the S4S compare to your CSL? Is the M3 that much better or both great?

The Esprit (being from the 90s and despite the factory Bilstein upgraded dampers) is still more of a GT car. The seats are also nowhere near as supportive as the CSL ones (I'd like to fit some Sport 300 style ones from an Elise or the like). Also, it's only 25kg lighter than the CSL (so not sufficient enough to be faster). It has 30bhp less power, but 60lb ft more torque but only in the mid-range (thanks to the turbo), but it doesn't make this until 4000rpm and then starts to die off from 5000rpm where it is 30lb ft down on the CSL by 7000rpm (due to the turbo sizing). So on the road, the performance is pretty much equal, but on the track, the Esprit would be left WAY behind (it's just too soft and the power is all in the mid-range, where the CSL is the other way round - sharp and hungers for revs).

Obviously a standard S4S would be slower than even a normal M3 - that's almost 10 years of progress for you..... But then no BMW can shoot helicopters out of the sky or go underwater .

The overboost they used to rave about at the time, was just created by a softly sprung wastegate actuator. Once you got to 4600rpm with a wide-open-throttle, the exhaust gasses would just push open the wastegate and the boost would drop off to 0.7 bar LOL. Not exactly sophisticated.

[01SG]

Is the M3 that much better or both great?

The Esprit is a supercar....it compared favorably to the Ferraris of the day.

And it's also a submarine.

[Bimmerjeff]

Also representing the "Lots Of Trouble Usually Serious" brigade

Luckily, I live just 8 miles from the factory .



Extensively modified, so pushes out more power at the wheels than the factory car does at the flywheel (plus a Quaife ATB, as one-wheel fire sucks) and V8 GT Brembo brakes.

Also an S2000 (which I adore) - again, extensively modified, but OEM+ looks (and no BGW):



Obviously the CSL and to satisfy my two-wheeled habit, a Triumph 765 RS:

Awesome rides! How does the S4S compare to your CSL? Is the M3 that much better or both great?

[Bimmerjeff]

Is this a 1750? Very nice. Been thinking about picking up an older Alfa since I got a Guilia Ti last year.

It's a 1300GT actually, with a 1600 motor now. The last 2 years of production in EU 75-76, Alfa put all the 2000 bits onto the Juniors as well, so only difference thne was the 1300/1600 motor vs the 2000 GTV.

[kaiv]

& as of last week I added a super clean 01' 740iL to the fleet. Stratus Metallic over Black.

Absolutely stunning!!

[kaiv]

Congrats Mirza!!

[terra]

Alright I'll be the guy , really man.



You're the best Terra (just in case I have a question I need an answer to).

Lol. Well I have a 120 mile round trip commute so comfy car and electric is nice there. And the acceleration is utterly ridiculous.

[oceansize]

I know not everyone’s cup of tea here, but I bought myself a model s plaid. 1000hp sure is addictive.

Alright I'll be the guy , really man.



You're the best Terra (just in case I have a question I need an answer to).

[Andratch]

I know not everyone’s cup of tea here, but I bought myself a model s plaid. 1000hp sure is addictive.

Nice. My DD is a P90D with a big brake kit - way slower than a plaid, but still a lot of fun and super easy to drive as a daily!

[terra]

I know not everyone’s cup of tea here, but I bought myself a model s plaid. 1000hp sure is addictive.

[Lavatoad]

Just sold my e36 ME track car, and picked up a 987.2 Cayman S. First foray into the Porsche world.