Pagid RS14 or RS29 (on AP brakes)?

[Franzino]

Hi,

I don't have a M3 CSL But I have the a Z4M with AP brakes and it's exactly the same brake set-up as on the M3 CSL A lot of CSL owners uprated their OEM brakes to AP brakes and drive their cars on the track, so this seems like a good place to ask....

Currently I'm running Pagid RS4-2 (blue) on street and track. They squeal light on the road and on the track they preform ok (but not stunning). If the blue's would be perfectly silent, then maybe I would keep them as a all round street and track pad. But they are not silent! The blue make noise with light braking, so when this is the case IMO it's better to upgrade to better trackpads (which will also squeal). Sometimes the blue's leave some pad deposit on the rotors after hard track work and this results in a temporally steering judder. Noise will be the same with higher Pagids pads, but in my opinion braking will be improved (on track).

I'm planning on changing to other Pagid brake pads and have difficulty choosing between RS14 (black) or RS29 (yellow).

Considering squealing noise, to make them more silent the edges will be chamfered with 45degrees and on the back op de pads there will be a little copper grease.

I'm looking for the best compromise; Which one preforms best with low temperatures (when driving on street), makes the least noise and performs good on track and has some good initial bite??? Noise is still an issue (I don't want them to be much louder then my already loud blue ones). I want the most silent of the two and best performing with low temperatures. I was thinking of buying the endurance Pagid RS29 (all round) or the set up Pagid advised me for my car; RS 14 (front) & RS4-4 (rear)

Any opinions?

Thanks,

[Graham]

I have the RS29's and they're perfect. No squealing, good cold performance and exceptional hot performance

[Franzino]

I have the RS29's and they're perfect. No squealing, good cold performance and exceptional hot performance

Do you have AP brakes or OEM brakes... I presume your car is a e46 M3?

[billyboysm3]

I've got pf discs with Rs29 yellow all round.

What I found is that when you mince around town they squeal.

When used properly, braking hard and on track they are fine.

In the winter they do need warming up though

[cantfind1]

que....shimmy!

[Graham]

Do you have AP brakes or OEM brakes... I presume your car is a e46 M3?

Yes not a CSL, I'm just here because everyone actually goes on track rather than other forums :hahaha:

I think my discs are PF and yeah AP 6 pots, they've never squealed

[shimmy]

que....shimmy!

Hello

[alexk]

RS14 is the winner !

They don't squeal and their performance is far superior than RS29s in any temperature.
They just don't last as long.

[shimmy]

RS14 is the winner !

They don't squeal and their performance is far superior than RS29s in any temperature.
They just don't last as long.

but they are more usable down to the last 2mm unlike RS29

[Franzino]

After some research on this and other forums I ordered RS14 (front) and RS4-4 (rear)...

The different front and rear set-up was advised by the guys from Pagid.

For the Z4 (and for BMWs in general) a very good track set up is RS14 black front pads and RS4-4 orange rear pads. A lot of pro teams do that.

Due to the weight transfer during braking the front brakes do most of the job, especially on a front engine car. In our experience the brake balance is better when using less friction on the rear axle. On an ABS car you won't feel so much difference but it is better to stay out of the ABS especially with a none racing ABS.

With the original brake there is less dynamic weight transform (shifting weight to the front axle and reduce it on the rear axle) because stopping power is just not as good. So the OE brake is set up for these road conditions. On the track, in relation to road use, you can use more front brakes and therefore want to have a more aggressive front pad. For instance in race cars with a balance bar master cylinder system drivers turn more brake bias to the rear in slick conditions (e.g. rain) because there is less dynamic weight transfer and consequently more rear brake can be used.

[shimmy]

rs14 are great pads but with rs4-2 at rear watch put for some squirreling on track as the back tries to overtake the front!

[Franzino]

rs14 are great pads but with rs4-2 at rear watch put for some squirreling on track as the back tries to overtake the front!

???
RS 14 black will be on the front and RS 4-4 orange (not 4-2) on the rears. Why would in your opinion the back try and overtake the front with this RS4-4 or RS4-2 on the back? Makes no sense! A car with a brake balance like you describe is something Pagid or other brake specialists would never advice. The RS4-4 is a less agressive pad then the RS14. RS 4-4 has less initial bite and is a pad that is used a lot as a rear pad in combination with RS 14.

http://www.pagid-brake-pads.co.uk/products/rs44-orange-carbon-based.php

[shane@mbtech]

???
RS 14 black will be on the front and RS 4-4 orange (not 4-2) on the rears. Why would in your opinion the back try and overtake the front with this RS4-4 or RS4-2 on the back? Makes no sense! A car with a brake balance like you describe is something Pagid or other brake specialists would never advice. The RS4-4 is a less agressive pad then the RS14. RS 4-4 has less initial bite and is a pad that is used a lot as a rear pad in combination with RS 14.
http://www.pagid-brake-pads.co.uk/pr...rbon-based.php

He read it on google:hahaha:

Sometimes the back not clamping down can cause it to lift and go light so a less braking rear can give the same effect as a rear end clamping and locking.

[Franzino]

He read it on google:hahaha:

Sometimes the back not clamping down can cause it to lift and go light so a less braking rear can give the same effect as a rear end clamping and locking.

First time I hear about this effect... If this is the case why would Pagid advice me to use this set-up? Is asked which set-up gave the best brake balance and they advised the RS14/RS4-4 for my car and other BMW's. I'm now driving with RS4-2 all round on my full AP kit. With heavy braking I found that the ABS comes in faster then when I was driving with the original brake set-up.

The guys from Simpson Motorsport (UK) and other specialists have the same opinion;

On most BMWs you will find that the AP 4 pot caliper is a little large for the rear, and that a softer pad will generally work better in the rear with the APs.

[alexk]

First time I hear about this effect... If this is the case why would Pagid advice me to use this set-up? Is asked which set-up gave the best brake balance and they advised the RS14/RS4-4 for my car and other BMW's. I'm now driving with RS4-2 all round on my full AP kit. With heavy braking I found that the ABS comes in faster then when I was driving with the original brake set-up.

The guys from Simpson Motorsport (UK) and other specialists have the same opinion;

Maybe because they want to get rid of the stock of rear RS4-4 :thumbs:
I run RS-14 front & back, all good here :beer: *** although I am not racing.