Cheap, long lasting track tire?

[Nick_P]

I recently switched to the Federal FZ-201M cuz they’re cheap and thought I couldn’t really go wrong for the price $700-800 in 265/35/18…but man so far these tires suck! Coming from Yokohama A052s in same size so far it feels like the FZ-201s are a downgrade in plenty of aspects:
1. Lower levels of grip, about 2secs slower lap times on a 1:25 track
2. More time to get up to temp, with the A052s my outlap was normally enough to get them up to temp. The Federals require a couple of warmup laps.
3. Annoyingly loud on the street whereas the Yokos were dead silent!
4. They felt greasy towards the end of a couple sessions but I need more time with them to form an opinion on this. They def require lower starting (cold) tire pressure.

I only have ~2 track days on the Federals so ~6 cycles but so far I can’t wait to get rid of them. They’re almost half the price compared to Yoko A052s or Goodyear S3R but so far imo you get what you pay for with these tires. We’ll see how they wear out…

[foolio]

Well, I ordered a set of Maxxis RC1 R2. I’ll report back on my findings. I have a couple track weekends coming up in the next month. One of which is at my “home” track, Putnam Park where I have plenty of reference laps with NT01’s.

[bigjae46]

I was going to try the Maxxis RC1s but I just ordered Toyo RR’s. They are $250 more per set with heat cycling. If they can last one more weekend I’ll be happy. From what I’ve read, the RRs last a little longer than the NT01s.

I need a 3rd set of wheels to heat cycle them myself. It was only $60…why not? Saves having to swap wheels at the track.


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[Albino09]

The endurance racers use Hankook RS4s, Dunlop Direzza Z2/Z3s, Falken RT615k+ as the gold standard of lasting a looooooong time. I have personal experience setting my own PB on a set of corded Dunlops - the grip doesn't change. I have a set of 615Ks right now on my own car in 235/265 fitment because they've come down in price since the RT660 came out as the top dog for Falken track tires.

[foolio]

Just wanted to report back on my first experience with the Maxxis RC1 R2’s. I was running at Grattan this weekend up in Michigan. This was my first time at this track and it was a three day event. Since I was going to spend the first part of the weekend just learning the track I decided to keep on my Toyo R888R’s to set a baseline. The Toyos only had one session on them at Pitt-Race back in June so they were pretty new as well. By Saturday afternoon, I feel had gotten everything out of those tires (in terms of my skill after two days at this track anyway) and was consistently turning laps in the 1:30 time range. As usual I was running with no traction control so I could move the car around to my liking without interference. On Sunday morning I switched over to my wheels with the RC1’s.
My findings were that the RC1’s were worth two seconds on this track. I got consistent times down in the 1:28 range. I found them to be easily controllable and quieter than the Toyo’s. They honestly felt very much like in NT01s. This track is very easy on tire wear so after five sessions I can’t really say how they’re holding up because they still look pretty much brand new. They did seem to lose a little bit as the day got hotter (I think we hit 86°F) but I suppose that’s pretty much to be a expected of any tire.
So, overall a good first impression. I look forward to trying these out in a couple more weeks at my home track (Putnam Park) to see how they fare against my times with the Nittos.

[Tonggi]

I run NT01s because they last ~forever, and stay pretty much the same until you see cord.

What's your experience with the shelf life of NT-01s if they are covered and stored in a climate controlled garage before losing grip? 2-3 years? I'm worried about the # of events a year ill do versus their wear.

When not in use I plan to put in those tire rack tire covers and in my garage (climate controlled by then hopefully) I will drive to and from events and do some auto x.

[Obioban]

What's your experience with the shelf life of NT-01s if they are covered and stored in a climate controlled garage before losing grip? 2-3 years? I'm worried about the # of events a year ill do versus their wear.

When not in use I plan to put in those tire rack tire covers and in my garage (climate controlled by then hopefully) I will drive to and from events and do some auto x.

The longest I've ever had a set was 2 years, but that was fine.

[Radekxpl]

This season I been running Federal fz-201 Mediums NOT Soft there a significant difference in wear and handling in 285/30/18 square. I very surprised how long the have lasted me so far I have 34 20 min sessions on them and I’m at just the wear marks with tread still left easily for another 1-2 days on them which far more than I anticipated from them. Like the grip on them as well predictable break away, grip has been consistent throughout full session does not grease up. Only downside side is they do require more warm time than others. In comparison this season I have also ran rt-660s they get up to temp in half the time , in terms of lap times I been running very similar lap times on both with one giving the edge to the other depending on conditions, but rt-660 lasted only 24 sessions plus you have to fill them from side to side half way through their life to get even wear patter since their directional. Fz201 you can just rotate front back side to side since thread is not directional which I think is really helps in terms of wear usually bern rotating them every event depending on which track attending since some tracks have provide more left side wear then right ect. the noise is insane on the fz201m really bad compared to rt-660 but that to be expected with the thread pattern this tire has, after all it’s a competition tire not street tire so that shouldn’t really matter since it’s meant for the track not street driving. For the price fz201m can’t really beat them got set for $700 last year cheap compared to others like rt-660 where $1k lasted half of the time. Think I’m going to getting second set of these.


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[bigjae46]

I’ve been running heat cycled Toyo RRs for a weekend at COTA and MSR Houston. As a long time NT01 user I would describe these as a slightly faster NT01. I switched from an old set of NT01s to the RRs mid day and didn’t skip a beat.

I ran my NT01s at 30psi hot, 22psi cold. Anything hotter the tires would grease up. The RRs like a little more pressure. 32psi hot - 24psi cold seemed like the sweet spot. Had some longer sessions and the RRs never got greasy.

The RRs tolerate sliding just like an NT01. The NT01s still make some noise, the RRs are dead silent when you go over the limit.

Lap times, I think the RRs were a little faster but not by much. Maybe a second at MSR Houston.

The wear rate looks better on the RRs although not quite as easy to tell since there is no tread pattern. I run -3.8 camber in front and -3.0 in the rear. The shoulders look good, same as the NT01s. So I expect to get similar life…maybe more!

Overall, glad I got the RRs. I think these will be my new tire. They cost $60 more per tire including heat cycling but I think these tires are going to last longer. I beat them up and the tread shows very little wear. If I drove the NT01s that hard for that long they would grease up and wear out pretty fast. In the end, I think these RRs are going to be cheaper.


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[SQ13]

I hated my Federal FZ-201Ms. Currently have Accelera 651s in both 100 and 200 TW. The 200s are faster than the Federals I had at COTA (IME). They’re okay…I have no experience using other 200TW tires on my M3, but these didn’t feel great and increased my braking distances. My complaints with the 200TW 651s are probably strictly due to the fact that they’re 200TW tires, which just aren’t as sticky as the tires I’m used to using. I’ll be using the 100TW 651s at COTA in Dec and will report back.

Out of all the tires I’ve used on track, I still think NT01s are the best, followed by NS-2Rs. Tire prices suck these days and I’m scared to see what a set of 275/35R18s will cost me when I’m ready for more rubber.

[foolio]

I know I said I would report back after running the Maxxis RC1 R2 tires at my home track, Putnam Park. We had good weather albeit a little cool but that worked out ok because my prior time at Putnam Park the weather was similar and I set my PB on my preferred NT01s. All in all, I find them very similar but a tick slower. I was also instructing this particular weekend so having a student in the car probably hurt my times a little. Perhaps a session alone I could have equaled the NT01’s. They were that close. I could only get within a second of my PB on the Maxxis. My consistency was very good lap after lap (when I didn’t hit traffic) being within a second of each other. I can’t yet speak for longevity but the wear seems really good so far. They did seem to “talk” a little less than the NT01’s but weren’t so silent that I couldn’t get feedback. Of course, my Bimmerworld race exhaust doesn’t help when it comes to hearing the tires . They didn’t *feel* slower but the times were not up where I wanted them. All in all, I would get these again provided they wear well. I will look forward to getting some NT01’s though next time I need tires. I have two sets of wheels but now I have these R888Rs that I need to burn through before I get more NT01’s. Not of big fan of the Toyos for my driving preference but they do seem to be a good consistent tire…just not quite on the same level as the Maxxis or NT01’s in terms of lap times.

[F1Dryvr]

I have found the R888Rs get super greasy ~15 minutes into the session.

Ive experienced this but its usually the hottest session of the day(2pm) and cooling off a couple laps and its good again. I do like their level of grip and apart from the hottest conditions i find them quite consistent over a session. I want to try the nto1s though they now have a 265/40 which i think ill try when they come off back order.

I have a question,....my R888Rs are about 4 years old now, probably have 12-14 track days total on them and minimal street driving just for shakedowns. I only get to the track 2-3 times a year and they have plenty of rubber left on them. Does anyone consider a shelflife for track tires irrespective of use/wear, assuming theres plenty of rubber left? I always take the wheels off the car and deflate to 15 psi during downtimes.( i heard this was a good thing to do)

How long would u keep (for track use) a set of tires for?

[bigjae46]

Long term update on the RRs...

The RRs were heat cycled. My alignment specs are -3.8F and -3.0R for camber, zero toe up front, .07 toe in at the rear.

I have 19 sessions or heat cycles, 171 laps at 3 tracks and 382 miles on them so far. I think the tires started falling off noticeably a little bit the last day. Maybe a .5 to 1 sec during the last 2 heat cycles. By falling off, I DO NOT mean it's like driving on ice. I started noticing I couldn't trail brake any deeper when the day before I knew I could. And the data shows the car wouldn't accelerate as quickly. It is a slight difference, kind of hard to tell. Without data, might not even really notice until new tires are thrown on.

I run 275/40R17s. Cost for the NT01s is $1150. I typically get 4.5 weekends out of the NT01s. At that point, the tread is smooth and the grip is fallen off by 2 seconds per lap, started out at 1:42 per lap when new. I haven't corded an NT01 in 2 years...they just get to the point of garbage.

Cost for the RRs was $1300 incl tax and heat cycling. The tread is still in good shape. I can still see the two grooves in all of the tires, I think I can get at least 2 more days out of them. Maybe 4 days if I run them all the way to the cords. The wear pattern is the same as what I get on the NT01s with the same alignment specs except a little more toe in at the rear with the NT01. If I can get a full 4 weekends out them, I'd be happy. 5 weekends with the last weekend having decent grip...these will be my new tire for sure.

NT01 - $255 per weekend
RR - $260 per weekend

About the same cost - more grip from the start and then will likely be the same at the end assuming 5 decent weekends.

[r4dr]

That's interesting about the NT01s cycling out before they cord. That's the opposite of what I've heard as conventional wisdom, and the couple of times I ran NT01s they were good down to the cords as well.

The Pro3 racing guys up here run RRs as their spec tire, so for my E30 I have no shortage of cheap scrubs. $100/set is not bad at all.

[bigjae46]

That's interesting about the NT01s cycling out before they cord. That's the opposite of what I've heard as conventional wisdom, and the couple of times I ran NT01s they were good down to the cords as well.

The Pro3 racing guys up here run RRs as their spec tire, so for my E30 I have no shortage of cheap scrubs. $100/set is not bad at all.

I’ve always been faster on fresh NT01s.

My car is 2900lbs with driver and 1/2 tank. I used to just cord NT01s with mostly consistent pace at 3100-3200lbs. Only recently since I’ve added aero and got down to 2900 lbs that I’ve had the heat cycling issue.

I let my buddy run the last set once they get bald and he corded them in 2 sessions.


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