M3 gts

[windy]

t has all the right boxes ticked, yet the enthusiasts still complains - come on .. this is more of a club racer than the CSL ever was ...

Very well put.

I'll bet the same things were being said when the CSL was first released... overpriced... not enough power... not enough weight loss...

Nicely hardcore IMHO, and if you're the sort of guy who runs a GT3 as a track-car (and whose mates probably do too) it makes a nice alternative :thumbs:

You all moaned when BM said they'd not do a new CSL... this is a CSL+ :smokin:

[alexk]

You all moaned when BM said they'd not do a new CSL... this is a CSL+ :smokin:

I am not sure that's a 'CSL'.
The brakes, suspension, cage and seats are obvious.
Does it has any special parts like the CSL ? Bumper, trunk etc etc etc ?
Maybe yes, maybe not. We don't know yet I guess.
It seems like it's something 'quick and dirty', when looking the front spoiler and rear spoiler. So, I am not sure (I could be wrong) if the car has everything, everything changed.
The rear spoiler is the ones we see in Fast n Furious and we are laughing.
The CSL cup cars have nicely made HUGE spoilers and they look awesome.

That doesn't make it a bad car.
I think it's a good car but it's clear that BMW targets in new customers, not the traditional BMW owner.

I only wish they had these brakes in our CSL, because I am having issues with the MOT of Switzerland.

[azrael]

If its a limited production run car, then the cost per car is bound to be higher when taking in r&d, safety compliance etc

[_Nathan_]

+1


Let's clarify...

M3 GTS = 3 x CSL ?

er, no.

CSL = 6x e36 M3 er, no, silly argument - look at what it is up against new...

it is €30k cheaper than a GT3RS in Germany, let's see what the UK pricing works out like...

[_Nathan_]

The CSL cup cars have nicely made HUGE spoilers and they look awesome.

but they don't have to pass type approval...

Credit to BMW, they'd made an extreme version of the M3, more extreme than the CSL, I think it is awesome, a 2 seater, caged M3 with adjustable suspension and decent brakes, less weight and a bigger engine :smt055

Wait until the tuners get hold of that 4.4 too - 500+ bhp :thumbs:

[shimmy]

only problem i have with the car is that it seems more like a road version of a GT4 made just so that it can be made into race cars by BMW and not designed for road use or sale in particular (unlike GT3 and RS)

the add ons look aftermarket at best even down to the seat which look like bog standard recaros you can get for less than the CSL seat

If all these mods are aftermarket items why should thye be charging £100k even if that is what it cost to produce due tot he limited numbers

The engine obviously has been increased in capacity once again just soi they can race that engine capacity and not becasue the road car needs the exra 0.4litres just to get 30bhp.

Lets not forget current M3 is £51k OTR whereas the GTS is DOUBLE THAT

[_Nathan_]

Wait and see on the pricing, there are rumours of it being less than that in the UK. It is €30k less than a GT3RS in Germany which would make it around £85k here if the pricing structure was similar, that is Gt3 money and I'd rather have this than a cooking GT3 (not that I can afford either).

[glendog74]

but they don't have to pass type approval...

Credit to BMW, they'd made an extreme version of the M3, more extreme than the CSL, I think it is awesome, a 2 seater, caged M3 with adjustable suspension and decent brakes, less weight and a bigger engine :smt055

Wait until the tuners get hold of that 4.4 too - 500+ bhp :thumbs:

Well said Nathan:thumbs:

As others seem to be mooting, I don't think that you can directly compare this with an E46 M3 CSL. These are totally different cars with several years of R&D and advances in technology between them. This is not being touted as the spiritual successor or 'son of CSL' after all...

Like others have also said, yes - you could take a standard E92 M3 and turn it into something very similar for probably less money, but that does not make it an M3 GTS/GT4 just like tuning or modifiying a Porsche 997 C2S does not make it a genuine Porsche 997 GT3... :whistle:

I do think that early indications of its 'proposed price' do seem a tad on the steep side, but that said, i would certainly be very very interested in such a rare car when it is 3 years old and has shed a big amount of value, making it a superb track focussed bargain! :supz:

[alexk]

but they don't have to pass type approval...

This spoiler has to pass approval. Have a look at it ->



I was showing the GTS to family member today and was telling me that they run like crazy in BMW AG, because of the competition (Audi, Mercedes).
This car was 'cooked' in no-time.
It's clear that most of the obvious bits of the car are 'quick and dirty'.

Does anybody remember that the CSL was introduced in 2001 and brought to the public in 2003 ? Is that 2 years ?

[_Nathan_]

Don't see your point with the gallardo one? it is smaller than the M3 one and has no end plates

[shimmy]

This spoiler has to pass approval. Have a look at it ->



I was showing the GTS to family member today and was telling me that they run like crazy in BMW AG, because of the competition (Audi, Mercedes).
This car was 'cooked' in no-time.
It's clear that most of the obvious bits of the car are 'quick and dirty'.

Does anybody remember that the CSL was introduced in 2001 and brought to the public in 2003 ? Is that 2 years ?

I agree its a rush job to help them with racing GT4 i guess. Gives them a bigger engine to play with etc etc

My guess is it will be BMW Ag sale only and fixed one price and very limited run.

Dont forget for £50k you could do this power/weight change (apart from engine capacity) with a stock M3 and have change is my guess. Its not like you have the subbtle changes that the CSL had at first glance

[Ade]

This car was 'cooked' in no-time.
It's clear that most of the obvious bits of the car are 'quick and dirty'.

Does anybody remember that the CSL was introduced in 2001 and brought to the public in 2003 ? Is that 2 years ?

I think this is the issue. I have no problem with a 100k BMW/M3-shaped track monster, but you would hope that the finished article looked more cohesive and as if it wasn't a Halfords parts bin special.

The enduring value of the CSL years later until today is that it is a fabulously well finished product that demonstrates the exceptional effort/thought/engineering that went into refining an already then-class-leading product. Demand for, and used values reflect this.

The CSL appeals like an expensive folded steel Japanese cooks knife, in the same way the GT3 is such a well refined, evolved, and cohesive design. The GTS is, in comparison, a very expensive Ikea plastic handled knife that although cheap looking, will be fit-for-purpose no doubt.

Buyers of 100k machinery want something that goes AND looks special.

[_Nathan_]

if you remember the CSL was universally slated when it came out and it was massively overpriced and as such prices dropped 35% in the first 18 months, I don't see anything different with the GTS, once they are cheap enough everyone will fall in love with them as they did with the CSL.

[shimmy]

if you remember the CSL was universally slated when it came out and it was massively overpriced and as such prices dropped 35% in the first 18 months, I don't see anything different with the GTS, once they are cheap enough everyone will fall in love with them as they did with the CSL.

maybe (probably) but for the prices to recover it has got to have something special and the only thing i can see is the exclusivity (as i guess there will be very very few made) and the engine choice

everything else you can buy from Unit 7, Roaring Meg Industrial Estate, Stevenage :whistle:

[_Nathan_]

people said the same about the CSL, £20k more than an M3, it isn't even any faster, put those tyres on a normal M3 and you are 95% of the way there, there is nothing special about it etc etc.

Wait until there is some more information on how they've saved weight and what else has been done to it. Of course you could make a normal M3 faster for less money, same was true with the CSL too, the devil will be in the detail...

PS. Anyone know if the 7:40 time round the ring was with the tyres it has in the pictures? If it did that time on them then I'm amazed!