My OEM+ M3/4/5 Ownership Progression...

[m3f_umichchris]

yup, thats the guy. great work and cool dude.

I'm positive it was Tony. I can vouch for a great guy and great work. He will do as subtle or as drastic as a person wants, but he will always warn of the risk, cons, etc. He happens to be a photographer and writier/ contributor for Performance BMW, and a few of the other rags I'm far to cheap buy at the grocery stand.



http://www.r3vlimited.com/board/showthread.php?t=165114

[m3f_Nick325xiT 5spd]

yea, that makes sense. i mod because im an enthusiast. ive owned 5 bmws in my life and never left any of them stock. im not a young kid in school....even if that was the case there's nothing wrong with that either. i think i was taken aback by the reaction....but at the same time i didnt start the thread for praise....just wanted to share and contribute to the board that has given me useful information and even inspiration....gotta pay it back in my own way.


those who dont like it....luckily for them they dont have to drive my car and i dont have to die of boredom in theirs haha

I prefer not to draw the eye to parts I'm too cheap to upgrade. Painting the stock calipers a bright color does nothing but scream "I wanted a BBK, but was too cheap to buy one!" (I'm also against wheels that don't fit. It just looks terrible and makes the car handle worse.)


I think that my sig provides a pretty good indication of where I stand on modifying cars.

[m3f_suaveflooder]

The responses in this thread vs. those on your Bf.c thread are sort of indicative of the audience on each forum (though many of us read both). Many members here tend to react negatively to what most people call "mods" (using big air quotes there) because they don't see fender rolls, painted calipers (etc.), and huge wheels as a "+" in "OEM+". Modding your lights with Bosch projectors is one type of mod (a massive functional improvement, OEM outside the US, and 100% reversible) vs rolling and pulling fenders, which alters the shape of the car (permanently?). The members on Bf.c tend to be more interested in the types of modifications you're making.


So yes, you're probably not going to get a ton of love for some of your mods here, but just understand that it's only due to the general inclination this forum has toward "stock". And while there can be a lot of negativity at times, this board is still (to me) the single best place to find out information and learn how to fix things, even before I crack the Bentley guide.

GREAT post. I agree, this is one of the best BMW forums I've seen


Some of the views toward OEM+ are always interesting to me. He is sticking with OEM BMW parts, so I don't see this as being a bad build. Plus, the work on the fenders is REALLY good. Meaning, short of a car guy walking up to the car (and maybe not even then), no one is going to look and go "Oh look! He pulled his fenders". Now the wheels aren't my taste, but they are easily swapped out, and calipers easily painted black. So far, I'm not seeing the real problem with this car yet.


I had a guy pass on my old M3, which was "everything he wanted" and a lot cheaper than he had planned to spend because I had replaced the center consol with an armrest delete one (ALL parts were OEM). I get finding the "perfect" car, but he passed on saving a couple grand because of an armrest.


If OP sells this car, as of now, it won't be hard to get back get rid of his "+" parts


Edit: Plus this is being done on an E36….it's not like parts are expensive for this car. Unlike EVERY OTHER M3 body type, this one has very few parts you can't just yank off of a regular 3 series. Parts are a dime a dozen

[m3f_fiveightandten]

hahaha i love it.


first forum ive ever been a part of with such negativity. its kind of refreshing & cute. ill continue to share...but knowing that it will only somehow rub you guys the wrong way. i hope your eyes bleed.

Posting out of spite sounds like a great idea.


You may continue to get flak for it. But i'm sure you know that, and you seem to enjoy it, so carry on.


FYI, I can explain the logic behind people thinking certain things are distasteful, as this doesn't just come out of thin air.


Wheels/Tires

The setup you choose added unsprung weight to the car, reduced the contact patch of the tire on the road, and required a fender roll. In short, it had a negative impact on handling, a negative impact on ride quality, a negative impact on fuel economy (due to the extra mass), and required an irreversible modification to do so. Oh, and tires are also now a lot more expensive.


With so many functional disadvantages, the reasoning behind this setup is clearly aesthetic. Though, most of us think 19" wheels don't look right on the E36 chassis. It kind of gives it that RC car look. Add all this up, and to an outside observer, there aren't any positive attributes to running this setup.


Fender roll

Personally, i've seen hundreds of E36's literally ruined by fender rolling. The rolling causes the paint to chip and flake off. Eventually the fenders rust and the car then requires expensive paint work, which never gets done. The rust spreads and ruins the car. It would've never rusted out if the fenders were left alone.


I haven't seen your car, and I can't say for sure that the paint will fail. But there's a high probability of that happening. So, from the standpoint of an outside observer, making an irreversible modification that has a high likelihood of making the car look worse than it did before the mod, in order to run a wheel/tire setup that (as we already discussed) doesn't seem to make sense...it's confusing.


Caliper painting

Some people have already explained this. But I suppose it's subjective. Painting the calipers won't do any harm to the car or hurt the functionality of it like the other stuff. But I personally would not have painted the brake pads or the clips. Painting the pads, in particular, is inviting them to bind up in the tracks.


I'm not trying to bag on your modifications. You just seemed taken aback and confused as to why people were against them. Hopefully that provides some insight.


The vader seat swap is clearly aesthetic, though it sucks that they don't adjust. I did this in my sedan, and although the sedan seats are better seats, the vaders are so iconic, I keep those in the car most of the time. I say put a 3 spoke in the car too. It's WAY nicer looking than the pickup truck 4 spoke they gave us.


Oh, you need new rear exhaust hangers, real bad. Replace those before you bend something. Also...get those damned wheels off your leather! It looks like you have fold down rear seats, as evident by the person punching the leather with their fist while presumably laying down in the trunk. So there's no excuse to have them on the leather.

[m3f_fiveightandten]

Oh...and when you post pictures of filthy carpeting, you're also supposed to post pictures of the carpet after you cleaned it. It's poor form to show 'before' pics and not show 'after' pics. We need the resolution.

[m3f_Solaris99]

Wheels/Tires

The setup you choose added unsprung weight to the car, reduced the contact patch of the tire on the road, and required a fender roll. In short, it had a negative impact on handling, a negative impact on ride quality, a negative impact on fuel economy (due to the extra mass), and required an irreversible modification to do so. Oh, and tires are also now a lot more expensive.

To add, the moment of inertia has changed for the worse. The mass has been spread farther from the hub center.

[m3f_umichchris]

Oh, you need new rear exhaust hangers, real bad. Replace those before you bend something. Also...get those damned wheels off your leather! It looks like you have fold down rear seats, as evident by the person punching the leather with their fist while presumably laying down in the trunk. So there's no excuse to have them on the leather.

yup, thats an old pic...i replaced those hangers in my garage about 2 months ago with the OEM replacements after reading up on how the aftermarket ones fail much quicker.



i thought about an exhaust upgrade at the time...but i dont want the car to be louder so i stuck with my oem muffler for now.





i wont argue or even defend my mods as its my car...but i agree with the unsprung weight comment. its purely for aesthetics....if ever i want to go fast...ive got a V10 parked next to it in my garage

[m3f_umichchris]

i actually took the car to a guy in the Inland Empire out here in SoCal to have the entire interior steam cleaned and the leather conditioned...he also revived the door cards, steering wheel and dash.


i was a putz and didnt take any photos....but the car smells new and looks near new now on the interior.


i also just got my order or Leatherique in the mail so im going to get the seats nice and soft. This weekend ill start with the passenger seat. im going to remove it and do a thorough job and reinstall on Sunday night...

Oh...and when you post pictures of filthy carpeting, you're also supposed to post pictures of the carpet after you cleaned it. It's poor form to show 'before' pics and not show 'after' pics. We need the resolution.

[m3f_suaveflooder]

Fender roll

Personally, i've seen hundreds of E36's literally ruined by fender rolling. The rolling causes the paint to chip and flake off. Eventually the fenders rust and the car then requires expensive paint work, which never gets done. The rust spreads and ruins the car. It would've never rusted out if the fenders were left alone.


I haven't seen your car, and I can't say for sure that the paint will fail. But there's a high probability of that happening. So, from the standpoint of an outside observer, making an irreversible modification that has a high likelihood of making the car look worse than it did before the mod, in order to run a wheel/tire setup that (as we already discussed) doesn't seem to make sense...it's confusing.

California car and rust? It does happen, but highly unlikely and usually with cars brought in from out of state or cars that sit at the beach and outside (even then I haven't seen it a lot). Plus any good fender roller worth a damn going to is going to heat the paint so there are no cracks (no metal esposed). Sorry, not meaning to stand up for the OP as I'm not a fan of his recent mods either, but you guys are getting pretty nitpicky

[m3f_umichchris]

its a California car. zero rust. zero paint issues other than years of wear and tear. and the fender rolling job was crazy good quality. no issues/cracks with the paint.



i welcome the nitpicking. i love the way my car looks and drives. ultimately, that will remain unshaken even if every member on the board attempts to denigrate my modding choices lol

California car and rust? It does happen, but highly unlikely and usually with cars brought in from out of state or cars that sit at the beach and outside (even then I haven't seen it a lot). Plus any good fender roller worth a damn going to is going to heat the paint so there are no cracks (no metal esposed). Sorry, not meaning to stand up for the OP as I'm not a fan of his recent mods either, but you guys are getting pretty nitpicky

[m3f_suaveflooder]

its a California car. zero rust. zero paint issues other than years of wear and tear. and the fender rolling job was crazy good quality. no issues/cracks with the paint.


i welcome the nitpicking. i love the way my car looks and drives. ultimately, that will remain unshaken even if every member on the board attempts to denigrate my modding choices lol

Something I've learned awhile ago is not to poke the bear. Like I mentioned, I'm not a huge fan of your recent mods, but it doesn't matter. Not my car. I bought an auto, which to a lot of people makes my car "not an M3" so I get it.


California car and you won't really ever have to worry about rust. One of the positives about living here. I've left bare metal for YEARS with no rust showing (rock chips). I doubt a fender roll is going to ruin your car.


Mod away, my friend! Keep posting! That fender rolling and pulling REALLY have me ing. Guy really did a killer job. I agree that you should put the wider tires back on and push the limits a bit on that pull as it will look awesome!!!! Just me

[m3f_Dpro]

California car and rust? It does happen, but highly unlikely and usually with cars brought in from out of state or cars that sit at the beach and outside (even then I haven't seen it a lot). Plus any good fender roller worth a damn going to is going to heat the paint so there are no cracks (no metal esposed). Sorry, not meaning to stand up for the OP as I'm not a fan of his recent mods either, but you guys are getting pretty nitpicky

I second all of th above. I have been into modding and building cars for years here in California rust is not an issue at all unless the car has lived it's life by the Ocean and outside there.

Plus like suave said anyone worth a damn who does fender rolling will not break paint at all. The chances of indenting above the well are in fact higher than breaking paint and the trick to that is heat and slow and careful.


I will also say I am not a fan of painting stock calipers and I don't agree on 19's but that roll and pull Would work great with my 18x9 +26 E46 M3 wheels on my 98 4/5. I will also say if anyone says I have disrupted the cars handling or made it worse? Then I feel they just might be on the conservative side of things and I have seen crazier on competitive track cars.


Low offsets do not automatically destroy the handling of the car! Neither do the wheels widths he has chosen, there are so many variables in suspension setup to make a blanket statement like that well ... I won't say anymore .

[m3f_Braymond141]

hahaha i love it.


first forum ive ever been a part of with such negativity. its kind of refreshing & cute. ill continue to share...but knowing that it will only somehow rub you guys the wrong way. i hope your eyes bleed.

Don't title your thread OEM+ then.

[m3f_suaveflooder]

Don't title your thread OEM+ then. No mods that you have done are better than OE, they are worse. The fact that you painted every part of the caliper shows how tacky this car will end up. Yuck.

OEM+ means OEM plus a couple other OEM (BMW) parts. If I throw a set of E46 M3 rims on my car, you gonna flame me?


Edit: I do have an E39 spoiler on it's way….should be here end of the month….I'm sure it's gonna look horrible . I actually consider my car OEM+ as well….

[m3f_Nick325xiT 5spd]

OEM+ means OEM plus a couple other OEM (BMW) parts. If I throw a set of E46 M3 rims on my car, you gonna flame me?


Edit: I do have an E39 spoiler on it's way….should be here end of the month….I'm sure it's gonna look horrible . I actually consider my car OEM+ as well….

I generally interpret OEM+ as staying basically stock, with mild, stealthy modifications. There is NOTHING OEM+ in my book about stretched tires on huge wheels, pulled fenders, or gaudy paint.


(And yes, to my eye, the pulled fenders are ugly. It completely screws with the lines of the car. I'm not so bothered by the rust issue.)