TCK DA vs KONI/EIBACH vs Bilstein/Eibach?

[m3f_2manym3s]

I am adding tck da's as a suspension option and was having a hard time finding recent reviews. Can anyone chime in here?

[m3f_Richardsperry]

Depends on what your intended use is. I'd never recommend Bilstein.


The DA's are noisy, and will require more frequent rebuilds.


What are you really looking for?

[m3f_fiveightandten]

What are you looking to hear about? Ride quality, handling characteristics, and longevity will all vary based on the spring rates, ride heights, and damper settings. So it can be tough sorting out information from other people, unless they're set up how you want to set your car up.


You buy coilovers because you need the extra adjustment they have over a spring/shock setup. And if that's what you need, you're pretty safe going with a tried and true company like TCK or GC.


I have the TCK SA kit. I never heard of the DAs being noisy.

[m3f_2manym3s]

I want the car to be comfortable and streetable yet have a solid setup for the track if/when I go. I am in a city so roads are not great, I have heard good things about the new bilstein shocks despite what guys say here. The only reason I am considering DA's is because there is an affordable set local to me. I am looking to hear how the comfort and drivability compares to the other options and if I'm stupid to thing I could enjoy them on back roads

[m3f_Cha5en]

Like we talked about, its all about how much tolerance you have for stiff ride on public roads, which the average public road sucks IMO for my back/stiff linear kits. I dont know your driving talent, but the truth is 99% of us here on the forum will have a blast on track with OE suspension, and a grippy tire. End of the day if you wanted to reduce body roll, the Koni/eibach with a large front sway is a great comprise between comfort and track.


Its my strong opinion that an adjustable height kit only needs to be used for someone who either wants to knock down lap times, aka is a very experienced driver to take advantage of adjustable damping settings, and height, or wants to get the low look. Unless you spend $$$$ for the custom valved linear spring kits, you're just not going to get the comfort that a koni/progressive spring w/ OE front mounts can offer. These cars have such a high limit stock, that I struggle to consider swapping out the fresh OE kit in my current E36. On the street with a PSS+, they are so damn quick, and on track with a RS3+ they can brake so late, and hold such a high level of grip into corner entry, its wild.

[m3f_Olemiss540]

a Koni setup with some HR OE springs is a perfect middle ground. a DA setup seems like overkill for your intended use, and when/if you ever decide to up the spring rates, just convert the springs with a linear spring conversion kit from GC.

[m3f_Zummie]

I am currently running this setup and it is very comfortable on the street. I one thing that I have been wanting to add in are GC street camber plates. My brother has the GC setup with the lowest spring rates(~375/400 lbs)offered and it is definitely more stiff, but does have less body roll and more go cart like. It depends on how your roads are where you live and what you are willing to put up with.

[m3f_fiveightandten]

I want the car to be comfortable and streetable yet have a solid setup for the track if/when I go. I am in a city so roads are not great, I have heard good things about the new bilstein shocks despite what guys say here. The only reason I am considering DA's is because there is an affordable set local to me. I am looking to hear how the comfort and drivability compares to the other options and if I'm stupid to thing I could enjoy them on back roads

A used set? Nah. Unless you want to rebuild the dampers and the springs are the exact rates you want, i'd pass. Used coilovers are enticing, but at the end of the day you're really best off getting new. The entire reason to buy them is to set the car up exactly how you want, with the spring rates of your choice and to have it in tip top running condition. Picking up someone else's spring rates and someone else's used dampers isn't optimal.


"I want the car to be comfortable and streetable yet have a solid setup for the track if/when I go. I am in a city so roads are not great,"


This does not describe dual adjustable coilovers. Unless the car is in dire need of suspension to replace worn parts, i'd recommend one of the following routes:


1) Wait to buy a setup until you track the car for a while and you know what you want. A dual purpose car needs compromise somewhere. It's really impossible to know where you want to compromise if you haven't driven the car outside of a street environment.


2) Get a setup that's geared towards the street, but is a bit sharper than stock and drive on it until you decide it's holding you back (presuming you start tracking the car and get very good at it).


For this i'd recommend the following:


A) Koni Yellows with H&R OE sports: This will be a bit more performance oriented without much of a reduction in ride quality compared to stock. It DOES ride a little harder, but the difference isn't huge and if you're driving a performance car, it's not likely something you would mind. With this setup, over stock, you're basically buying the aftermarket parts because you want the car to handle a little sharper than stock, at the expense of a slightly harder ride.


B) Koni Yellows with H&R OE sports, Ground control street camber plates, and sway bars of your choice: This will out corner setup #A, it will dive less, and feel a little sharper with respect to directional changes. It will have a barely perceptible difference in ride quality compared to setup #A (mainly over large uneven road imperfections). You'd set front camber to around -1.8º (anywhere from -1.5º to -2.0º, i'd shoot for -1.8º) with little or no front toe. Set the rear to factory specs. This is about as good as you can get in terms of having a responsive car without degrading the ride quality (over stock) notably.


This is a cut and paste from the last time you were asking about suspension for the car. There's a lot of good info in that thread from a number of people. Maybe it's worth re-reading.


http://www.m3forum.net/m3forum/showthread.php?t=546389

[m3f_Richardsperry]

I've read the other posts, here's my thoughts. Until you have logged a bunch HPDE's the car, even with a worn out suspension, the car will be WAY better than you are. The more you modify the suspension, the less forgiving of ham handed driving, the car becomes.


In other words, after you run out of talent, you're just going faster when you crash.

[m3f_fiveightandten]

I've read the other posts, here's my thoughts. Until you have logged a bunch HPDE's the car, even with a worn out suspension, the car will be WAY better than you are. The more you modify the suspension, the less forgiving of ham handed driving, the car becomes.



In other words, after you run out of talent, you're just going faster when you crash.

I'm all for out-driving the stock car before modifying, but i've got to disagree with that one, Richard. IMO, the progressive springs on the stock car make it less forgiving, and less confidence-inspiring. It has a lot of body roll and you need to drive it with more finesse. Getting linear springs on the car makes it more predictable and easier to deal with, IMO.



Also, worn shocks can be downright unruly and maybe even dangerous. They can, and do, bottom out where a healthy shock wouldn't, or oscillate over a bump where a healthy shock would keep the tire on the pavement. That can induce snap oversteer and unpredictable handling.

[m3f_englishtom1596q]

A used set? Nah. Unless you want to rebuild the dampers and the springs are the exact rates you want, i'd pass. Used coilovers are enticing, but at the end of the day you're really best off getting new. The entire reason to buy them is to set the car up exactly how you want, with the spring rates of your choice and to have it in tip top running condition. Picking up someone else's spring rates and someone else's used dampers isn't optimal.



"I want the car to be comfortable and streetable yet have a solid setup for the track if/when I go. I am in a city so roads are not great,"



This does not describe dual adjustable coilovers. Unless the car is in dire need of suspension to replace worn parts, i'd recommend one of the following routes:



1) Wait to buy a setup until you track the car for a while and you know what you want. A dual purpose car needs compromise somewhere. It's really impossible to know where you want to compromise if you haven't driven the car outside of a street environment.



2) Get a setup that's geared towards the street, but is a bit sharper than stock and drive on it until you decide it's holding you back (presuming you start tracking the car and get very good at it).



For this i'd recommend the following:



A) Koni Yellows with H&R OE sports: This will be a bit more performance oriented without much of a reduction in ride quality compared to stock. It DOES ride a little harder, but the difference isn't huge and if you're driving a performance car, it's not likely something you would mind. With this setup, over stock, you're basically buying the aftermarket parts because you want the car to handle a little sharper than stock, at the expense of a slightly harder ride.



B) Koni Yellows with H&R OE sports, Ground control street camber plates, and sway bars of your choice: This will out corner setup #A, it will dive less, and feel a little sharper with respect to directional changes. It will have a barely perceptible difference in ride quality compared to setup #A (mainly over large uneven road imperfections). You'd set front camber to around -1.8º (anywhere from -1.5º to -2.0º, i'd shoot for -1.8º) with little or no front toe. Set the rear to factory specs. This is about as good as you can get in terms of having a responsive car without degrading the ride quality (over stock) notably.



This is a cut and paste from the last time you were asking about suspension for the car. There's a lot of good info in that thread from a number of people. Maybe it's worth re-reading.



http://www.m3forum.net/m3forum/showthread.php?t=546389

100% spot on advice. My previous car was Koni SA's with H&R Sport springs and the car was an absolute pleasure to drive. Switched out to PSS9's because i wanted to join the cool coiler club and the car rode terrible, couldn't corner as fast and overall left me unconfident in the setup.

[m3f_Cha5en]

I'm all for out-driving the stock car before modifying, but i've got to disagree with that one, Richard. IMO, the progressive springs on the stock car make it less forgiving, and less confidence-inspiring. It has a lot of body roll and you need to drive it with more finesse. Getting linear springs on the car makes it more predictable and easier to deal with, IMO.


Also, worn shocks can be downright unruly and maybe even dangerous. They can, and do, bottom out where a healthy shock wouldn't, or oscillate over a bump where a healthy shock would keep the tire on the pavement. That can induce snap oversteer and unpredictable handling.

You do realize you can effectively reduce body roll with a progressive spring setup, right? Large front seats do wonders for the e36/46, and even a slightly stiffer rear and progressive spring will work well together. Try it sometime, as it works well on the street, and still gives even the experienced veteran a great feeling of when the cars going to break, granted you're still on a noisy street tire.


I don't think Richard was saying to run on worn out OE, either, just that a fresh OE kit will be more than enough grip for most.

[m3f_fiveightandten]

You do realize you can effectively reduce body roll with a progressive spring setup, right? Large front seats do wonders for the e36/46, and even a slightly stiffer rear and progressive spring will work well together. Try it sometime, as it works well on the street, and still gives even the experienced veteran a great feeling of when the cars going to break, granted you're still on a noisy street tire.



I don't think Richard was saying to run on worn out OE, either, just that a fresh OE kit will be more than enough grip for most.

I agree. In fact, i'm not sure why you seem to be disagreeing. You're providing further support to the point that I was trying to make; that modifying the car does not make it less forgiving.



Though I didn't see anyone say anything about larger seats.

[m3f_2manym3s]

I agree. In fact, i'm not sure why you seem to be disagreeing. You're providing further support to the point that I was trying to make; that modifying the car does not make it less forgiving.



Though I didn't see anyone say anything about larger seats.

I believe he meant to say sways, Nick I agree with you and I was not asking for more info, I am simply narrowing down my options and was wondering if a good used da kit (I'd have them rebuilt) would be worth a look.