Metal in Trans Fluid

[CrookedCommie]

Flying Fur Motorsports, E46M in GP1. Don't have details on the swap though I know they are tinkering with the TCU to get it working well. I think there is at least one more E46M running a similar setup in GP1.

[George Hill]

The PCR number 44 car GP1 car runs an E46 M3 MSS54 & 8HP for 3ish years now, I helped him put that swap together. It works but its far from ideal because the the Turbo Lamik transmission controller just doesn't interface with the DME well.

[eacmen]

Seems legit has figured most of the kinks out. Best option out there seems to be the maxxecu full standalone.

Wonder what the torque loss would be with the 8HP. The S54 isn't exactly a torque monster…

[George Hill]

Seems legit has figured most of the kinks out. Best option out there seems to be the maxxecu full standalone.

I'll believe it when I see it.

The Maxx has an intermittent issue with shifting an 8HP45, supposedly they are working on it but I know of at least one team that switched to DCT because of it. Maxx developed the 8HP software from an 70 and ported it to the 45. Allegedly the 70 doesn't have the issue, but no one is talking openly about the 45 issue either, so...

I have a Maxx on hand and was thinking about going to that on my wagon as it'll be 25yrs old soon and exempt from OBD testing. I am going to wait now until the 45 issues get figured out or Maxx is actively working on them.

I do not have any experience with the DCT setup though and it is something I have considered but I'm not sold its a better trans than an 8HP.

The 8HP45 with an N55 torque converter when used with the Turbo Lamik does not make a ton of power. A buddy has a theory that the TL is limiting torque through the DME somehow but we don't really have a way to verify that. And you can't really test the theory, but it seems like all of the 8HP45/TL/S54 combos I'm aware of do not make more than 310whp (my car included with CSL plenum, headers and tune).

[George Hill]

*** I should clarify that I personally think the all in one solution of the Maxx is likely the best option, but I'm not sold it is. I think the work CANTCU is doing is excellent and running a CANTCU with a number of standalone ECUs is likely a better option today, maybe not tomorrow though.

I also have a CANTCU and started testing it with CANTCU but we found the limitations were the DME and neither of us know it well enough to resolve it which is why I switched back to TL.

[eacmen]

I'll believe it when I see it.

The Maxx has an intermittent issue with shifting an 8HP45, supposedly they are working on it but I know of at least one team that switched to DCT because of it. Maxx developed the 8HP software from an 70 and ported it to the 45. Allegedly the 70 doesn't have the issue, but no one is talking openly about the 45 issue either, so...

I have a Maxx on hand and was thinking about going to that on my wagon as it'll be 25yrs old soon and exempt from OBD testing. I am going to wait now until the 45 issues get figured out or Maxx is actively working on them.

I do not have any experience with the DCT setup though and it is something I have considered but I'm not sold its a better trans than an 8HP.

The 8HP45 with an N55 torque converter when used with the Turbo Lamik does not make a ton of power. A buddy has a theory that the TL is limiting torque through the DME somehow but we don't really have a way to verify that. And you can't really test the theory, but it seems like all of the 8HP45/TL/S54 combos I'm aware of do not make more than 310whp (my car included with CSL plenum, headers and tune).

I know they only recommend the HP70.

So I guess drenth pneumatic… ?

I'm not going back to third pedal. Been too spoiled. Hoping to find a bullet proof solution, don't feel like keep swapping in junk yard trans with unknown condition.

This is the company with the carbon synchros. Spoke with Jim for a long time and was *very* knowledgeable on the 420 and other bmw boxes:

https://www.dropbox.com/scl/fi/dulqcrn1314x9vlj5xxl0/T17-MM-Ultimate-420-Getrag-6-Speed-Transmission-copy.pdf?rlkey=aqw2o6bdcoo2ivkvgx5dch1oo&dl=0

[George Hill]

I know they only recommend the HP70.

Most people go for the 70 because "its stronger" but our little S54s do not need that. And when you price out shipping a 70 from overseas (now with tariffs) and the adapter plate to mount it to the S54 its no cheap endeavor.

So I guess drenth pneumatic… ?

Can you run that on a stock DME?

I'm not going back to third pedal. Been too spoiled. Hoping to find a bullet proof solution, don't feel like keep swapping in junk yard trans with unknown condition.

This is the company with the carbon synchros. Spoke with Jim for a long time and was *very* knowledgeable on the 420 and other bmw boxes:

https://www.dropbox.com/scl/fi/dulqc...gx5dch1oo&dl=0

Agreed, I will never put a 3rd pedal back in my car unless I am developing something specific, which is why I've just been dealing with the TL limitations.

I think you are probably exceeding the 420g with what you are doing. But the solution likely hinges on what DME/ECU you are going to use.

[eacmen]

Most people go for the 70 because "its stronger" but our little S54s do not need that. And when you price out shipping a 70 from overseas (now with tariffs) and the adapter plate to mount it to the S54 its no cheap endeavor.





Can you run that on a stock DME?




Agreed, I will never put a 3rd pedal back in my car unless I am developing something specific, which is why I've just been dealing with the TL limitations.

I think you are probably exceeding the 420g with what you are doing. But the solution likely hinges on what DME/ECU you are going to use.

Yeah you can run the sequential on a stock DME since its effectively a manual. Tough part would be to get the timing right on the engine to torque cut when shifting.

Looking like the turbolamik kit for the 8hp might be the best option right now without a DME change.

I am not opposed to going full standalone. We'll see if we can breath some new life into this old box for now.

[George Hill]

Tough part would be to get the timing right on the engine to torque cut when shifting.

That's what I mean, obviously it'll work mechanically, but is it really "good?"

Looking like the turbolamik kit for the 8hp might be the best option right now without a DME change.

Its the best option on a stock DME, but you should experience before you make the switch if you are friends with the SLG guys. If you are in Austin I'll take you for a ride in my car and you might change your mind.

I am not opposed to going full standalone. We'll see if we can breath some new life into this old box for now.

Keep us posted with what you decide.

[eacmen]

So I dropped the trans. Did a refresh on the springs, clutch, flywheel, along with smg parts.

Clutch I removed looked almost new but was never changed under my ownership and the car has lived a very hard life.

I filled with D4 ATF but not all the way. I *slightly* underfilled to where i could feel the oil coming up to the fill plug but not pouring out. The hope there is maybe the 3/4 gearset will spend less of its life sitting in the sump of the trans and building up oil film on the syncros.

It might be a fools errand but we will find it after VIR in November.

Took the car for a test drive today and seems to be shifting fine. Really can't test it on public roads though.

[bigjae46]

So I dropped the trans. Did a refresh on the springs, clutch, flywheel, along with smg parts.

Clutch I removed looked almost new but was never changed under my ownership and the car has lived a very hard life.

I filled with D4 ATF but not all the way. I *slightly* underfilled to where i could feel the oil coming up to the fill plug but not pouring out. The hope there is maybe the 3/4 gearset will spend less of its life sitting in the sump of the trans and building up oil film on the syncros.

It might be a fools errand but we will find it after VIR in November.

Took the car for a test drive today and seems to be shifting fine. Really can't test it on public roads though.

Redline? You’ll likely find that you need to change that quite often. For some reason Redline trans fluids don’t have a long service life.

[eacmen]

Redline? You'll likely find that you need to change that quite often. For some reason Redline trans fluids don't have a long service life.

Yeah redline. I don't mind changing it.

The shop that rebuilds these actually recommends non-synthetic ATF and frequent change intervals as that seems to play nicely with the syncros. I had D4 ATF on the shelf so figured I would give it a shot.

Two fills ago I used the BMW OE original formula and the trans did not seem happy. Then the redline mt-lv seemed to be much better. And now i'm trying the D4 ATF…

[CrookedCommie]

I'm anecdotally convinced that redline eats synchros, have stopped using anything but CV-2 from them.

[eacmen]

I'm anecdotally convinced that redline eats synchros, have stopped using anything but CV-2 from them.

What do you run in your track car? I'm always open to suggestions.

[CrookedCommie]

What do you run in your track car? I'm always open to suggestions.

I had really good success with Ravenol MTF-2, ran that for a while and flushed every 2-3 events I believe. The old six speed would grind on fast shifts in 3 and 4 when cold but when it warmed up it was fine. I'm testing out Motul Gear Power 75w-80, the GL-4 one because there's also a GL-5 one, on the ZF320 I just put in.