7 year review of my SMG (from clunk to no clunk)

[oceansize]

Hey @Irhase46m3, this thread has been super helpful for me getting my SMG build sorted. Right now the SMG is running great with one lingering annoying issue. I get a cog light only on cold start that goes away after a warm start. The code I get from PA Soft is "3B [059] Clutch Control" and the code from Carley is "00003B Driving Clutch / Stall Speed". After some googling the first thing I did was replaced the speed sensor which had no impact. Next I reran the INPA Adaptation. This failed while cold, and worked while warm. Thoughts on anything else I should be trying? In the meantime the code seems to have no impact at all on the SMG performance.

This is most commonly the clutch slave cylinder due to the PLCD sensor which is not replaceable on its own (it is embedded into the clutch slave). Fortunately it is an easy job but it will require bleeding the system after replacement plus running adaptations. There is a difference between the SMG clutch slave and manual clutch slave. The SMG is more expensive of course.

https://www.ecstuning.com/b-genuine-bmw-parts/smg-slave-cylinder/21522229841/

[robgill]

Hey @Irhase46m3, this thread has been super helpful for me getting my SMG build sorted. Right now the SMG is running great with one lingering annoying issue. I get a cog light only on cold start that goes away after a warm start. The code I get from PA Soft is "3B [059] Clutch Control" and the code from Carley is "00003B Driving Clutch / Stall Speed". After some googling the first thing I did was replaced the speed sensor which had no impact. Next I reran the INPA Adaptation. This failed while cold, and worked while warm. Thoughts on anything else I should be trying? In the meantime the code seems to have no impact at all on the SMG performance.

[TramRam]

Lol at this point i can translate a bit of German - I strongly suggest you drop the transmission and service it even if its preventative, by you doing everything you are doing you are already going about 70% of the way and only an extra 30% to drop the transmission and depending on your mileage/driving characteristics, you clutch is probably on its way out.

Feel free to PM me with any questions you might have and i'll do my best to reply in a timely manner, good luck with your spring change, you might need to lower the front sub-frame abit to get enough pivot to reach the spring!

Well, get THIS...it's is the WORST (F) PART! The guy who rebuilt my engine is SNAIL SLOW but an impeccable builder, so I waited, waited & waited...it was almost 2 years that my car was off the road and my tranny was out & available to me! No doubt, had I just known I about these (F) springs I would definitely have CHECKED & simply replaced them but I only learned about them AFTER the engine and transmission were joined and in noticing slow & skip shifts I checked the Forums by my symptoms hundreds of miles after the engine break-in! I'm kicking my OWN (F) A*S! During the entire engine break-in when I was RIPPING on it hard repeatedly to 8200 with tons of down shifts for the rings in the last portion and all was fine! It was after maybe 500 miles that the sluggishness/delayed shifting started. 2nd to 3rd full throttle on-ramp runs when upshifts started to lag to the point I was nearly getting rear-ended several times by the cars I was blowing by! Anyway, I'll do what's needed to get to the springs. Just a real pisser to have missed a great opportunity earlier! Thanks for the info. I'm in an SMG 'desert' full of haters.

[Irhase46m3]

Thanks for your response. Sorry for dropping the conversation flow. To answer your questions Irhase46m3, I had a complete engine rebuild before this at a shop with only Snap On diagnostics. They did their best to keep the SMG hydraulic system closed but I wasn't convinced all was fine so I drove the car to Ft. Lauderdale to the shop of a friend with an Autologic. When he ran adaptations, he got a code indicating; 'shift gate end positions of odd gears implausible'. He said that my GPS was probably shot and should be replaced at least first to get that issue out of the way.Just around that time, a friend local to me had found an SMG M3 that he bought for cheap with the intention to convert it and offered any/all the SMG parts that were coming off. Two weeks later, I had all the parts including a completely clean, new looking GPS.By this time I had installed INPA but had no experience and no one near me who knows it. I asked him if there were any problems in the way the car shifts. He said not at all, that it shifted fine but that he 'never wanted an SMG car' & said the seller told him that the GPS had recently been replaced. Anyway, it's is now on my car now. It's after I installed it, the ONLY issue has been a laggy 4th gear shift. (3rd up AND 5th down. Like the other guys with a similar issue, once RPMs drop to around 3k, it will always engage but the fun was gone. FInally installing INPA but not having run adaptations before, I was a bit nervous but took the plunge and the outcome is what I reported above. I now have both springs to change out now and now I need the time to get them swapped out hoping for at least one broken spring! I emailed Burkhart who said my symptom strongly suggests a broken spring. I've read that with care & patience BOTH springs can be changed without taking the tranny OUT but the fan shroud needs to be removed along with unbolting the tranny mount to let the tranny drop, it would need to be as low as possible at its tail end. (I know about the driveshaft and exhaust needing to be removed. Like with most things, once you start you find your way. I appreciate reading the inputs of the other SMG/INPA pros! I never got the yellow Cog wheel with the red screen during the adaptation. The only thing I have now is once I turn the key to Position 2 & press the brake, I hear a 'clunk' as Neutral shows. All else is good as long as I drive reasonably but what fun is that?? Thanks for the help! PS. For those with Android phones, most have 'Google Translate'. Once you open it, it'll translate any German on the screen into ENGLEZ!! Kinda cool if you can't understand German.

Lol at this point i can translate a bit of German - I strongly suggest you drop the transmission and service it even if its preventative, by you doing everything you are doing you are already going about 70% of the way and only an extra 30% to drop the transmission and depending on your mileage/driving characteristics, you clutch is probably on its way out.

Feel free to PM me with any questions you might have and i'll do my best to reply in a timely manner, good luck with your spring change, you might need to lower the front sub-frame abit to get enough pivot to reach the spring!

[TramRam]

Hi There - in INPA, green = good, red = bad, its probably asking you to interrupt and break the procedure with F10 - I agree with burkhart, the delay is caused by either a broken spring or bad GPS both have similar symptoms but since you replaced the GPS (i assume with a new one) it should be the springs - What prompted you to replace the GPS? is it due to the delay in shifts? are you getting the yellow COG when you get the red screen in INPA? I assume that the bleeding procedures complete with the green screen followed by the printed "kein Fehler" (this means no error)

If you complete adaptation correctly, it will prompt you to start the engine (which you do) then it will tell you to hold the break pedal for 1-2 seconds then it will terminate with a green screen asking you to break and view the log files (which you should have a line that says "kein Fehler" (at least it does this on my germglish version of INPA)

I suggest replacing the spring before continuing with adaptations

Take a look at this thread, https://nam3forum.com/forums/forum/m...g-transmission

Thanks for your response. Sorry for dropping the conversation flow. To answer your questions Irhase46m3, I had a complete engine rebuild before this at a shop with only Snap On diagnostics. They did their best to keep the SMG hydraulic system closed but I wasn't convinced all was fine so I drove the car to Ft. Lauderdale to the shop of a friend with an Autologic. When he ran adaptations, he got a code indicating; 'shift gate end positions of odd gears implausible'. He said that my GPS was probably shot and should be replaced at least first to get that issue out of the way.Just around that time, a friend local to me had found an SMG M3 that he bought for cheap with the intention to convert it and offered any/all the SMG parts that were coming off. Two weeks later, I had all the parts including a completely clean, new looking GPS.By this time I had installed INPA but had no experience and no one near me who knows it. I asked him if there were any problems in the way the car shifts. He said not at all, that it shifted fine but that he 'never wanted an SMG car' & said the seller told him that the GPS had recently been replaced. Anyway, it's is now on my car now. It's after I installed it, the ONLY issue has been a laggy 4th gear shift. (3rd up AND 5th down. Like the other guys with a similar issue, once RPMs drop to around 3k, it will always engage but the fun was gone. FInally installing INPA but not having run adaptations before, I was a bit nervous but took the plunge and the outcome is what I reported above. I now have both springs to change out now and now I need the time to get them swapped out hoping for at least one broken spring! I emailed Burkhart who said my symptom strongly suggests a broken spring. I've read that with care & patience BOTH springs can be changed without taking the tranny OUT but the fan shroud needs to be removed along with unbolting the tranny mount to let the tranny drop, it would need to be as low as possible at its tail end. (I know about the driveshaft and exhaust needing to be removed. Like with most things, once you start you find your way. I appreciate reading the inputs of the other SMG/INPA pros! I never got the yellow Cog wheel with the red screen during the adaptation. The only thing I have now is once I turn the key to Position 2 & press the brake, I hear a 'clunk' as Neutral shows. All else is good as long as I drive reasonably but what fun is that?? Thanks for the help! PS. For those with Android phones, most have 'Google Translate'. Once you open it, it'll translate any German on the screen into ENGLEZ!! Kinda cool if you can't understand German.

[E46m3zcp]

My car has 67k miles and was garage kept and the rubber looks good at inspection. Of course, it's 14 years old so it may be a bit dry or stiff. It wouldn't hurt to refresh it.

You should upgrade your SMG software using the following links

I am confused with all the options, inertia mod or not, CSL, TTFS, Build Journal, Kassel, ECU Worx. Are there differences between all these tunes or are they basically flashing the ECUs with the same software ?

About ECU Worx, I understood from your links that one set of instructions is for flashing the SMG ECU but I don't get how the second page flashes the DME to match the CSL SMG program. Is it a checkbox in one of the hidden tabs? But thanks, I will do some more research I think.

EDIT: I see it now, it's the CSL SMG Shifting / Rev Matching checkbox.

[oceansize]

[QUOTE=E46m3zcp;n51587
Questions :
Who also experiences what I described? Who doesn't?
How can I make this behave better ?
Would a bleed help ? TTFS software ?
[/QUOTE]

You don't need to bleed unless your hydraulic system has been opened.

You could run smg/clutch adaptations using INPA or DIS.

Depending on the mileage and wear you may need to refresh all, or some, of your rear end bushings (subframe, diff, sway bar, upper and lower control arm) and ball joints.

You should upgrade your SMG software using the following links, these are separate upgrades that provide the full CSL experience:

https://www.ecuworx.co.uk/how-to/upd...-255-software/

https://www.ecuworx.co.uk/how-to/usi...fication-tool/

[E46m3zcp]

I am overall a happy SMG owner. I like it for everyday driving, but when driving hard I do not like the way it shifts.

If I am at WOT and shift past 6500 RPM there is a thud/clunk like if the car throws the transmission in gear or shifts before the clutch is fully disengaged. I don't know exactly what happens. It sometimes gets better if I release the throttle slightly while shifting. Other times though, this will confuse the smg system and the throttle input / clutch release gets out of sync and the clutch will slip. Very unpredictable and the result is I get the feeling I am beating the car up and driving it wrong.

Questions :
Who also experiences what I described? Who doesn't?
How can I make this behave better ?
Would a bleed help ? TTFS software ?


PFA

[Irhase46m3]

Irhase46m3 - I have INPA 5.0.6 on a Win10 64 bit that I downloaded from 'Mike's 1 Click' Having no one around me familiar with it to tell me if it's working correctly or not, I can only guess. I replaced my GPS and ran adaptations. In the end I did NOT see the note in your quote above asking me to do anything but it DID give me a red screen with a note 'break SMG2 installation procedure which I interpreted as the F10 'BREAK' key (Lwr Rgt Corner of the screen). Am I done or not? The car seems to drive pretty well except that with a laggy shift to 4th gear from 3rd OR 5th, Burkhart suggests that I need to check and replace my detente spring (behind the press in cap) I have it not but need to time to get to it. Am I on the right track with running my adaptations? Thanks in advance. TramRam

Hi There - in INPA, green = good, red = bad, its probably asking you to interrupt and break the procedure with F10 - I agree with burkhart, the delay is caused by either a broken spring or bad GPS both have similar symptoms but since you replaced the GPS (i assume with a new one) it should be the springs - What prompted you to replace the GPS? is it due to the delay in shifts? are you getting the yellow COG when you get the red screen in INPA? I assume that the bleeding procedures complete with the green screen followed by the printed "kein Fehler" (this means no error)

If you complete adapatation correctly, it will prompt you to start the engine (which you do) then it will tell you to hold the break pedal for 1-2 seconds then it will terminate with a green screen asking you to break and view the log files (which you should have a line that says "kein Fehler" (at least it does this on my germglish version of INPA)

I suggest replacing the spring before continuing with adaptations

Take a look at this thread, https://nam3forum.com/forums/forum/m...g-transmission

[TramRam]

This is a good question, both programs work and both bleed the system, ISTA/D is sequential bleed process that you have to manually run each step, INPA offers a more holistic approach, it does all the steps on its own and at the end asking you to press the break pedal (and hold) to start the car (ISTA/D never did this) - I believe (i have no facts to back me up on this other than how much smoother my car is shifting) that its within this step that makes the difference - Technically, both systems use the same data files so it should be the same.
Hope this helps!

Irhase46m3 - I have INPA 5.0.6 on a Win10 64 bit that I downloaded from 'Mike's 1 Click' Having no one around me familiar with it to tell me if it's working correctly or not, I can only guess. I replaced my GPS and ran adaptations. In the end I did NOT see the note in your quote above asking me to do anything but it DID give me a red screen with a note 'break SMG2 installation procedure which I interpreted as the F10 'BREAK' key (Lwr Rgt Corner of the screen). Am I done or not? The car seems to drive pretty well except that with a laggy shift to 4th gear from 3rd OR 5th, Burkhart suggests that I need to check and replace my detente spring (behind the press in cap) I have it not but need to time to get to it. Am I on the right track with running my adaptations? Thanks in advance. TramRam

[Mspir3d]

I was able to get my adaptations to complete when it failed by driving the car until it was warm and then running the program.

[eacmen]

How does the air in brake affect the SMG shifting? It can affect your driving but I don't see the SMG connection.

concur. has no affect


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[sapote]

Another thing that helped was bleeding my break system, for the longest time I had a tiny air bubble in the break system, bleeding and taking this air out helped with the shifting.

How does the air in brake affect the SMG shifting? It can affect your driving but I don't see the SMG connection.

[Irhase46m3]

Hey Irhase46m3 , thx for the post. Very timely for me, I have just finished relocating my pump with the BE kit and I'm in the process of bleeding. I have done a few successful bleeds with ISTA/D and will now do some more with the pump horizontal. Can you share more detail on why the ISTA/D bleed is different/worse than INPA? I gave up on INPA a few years ago and and haven't had any issue with ISTA/D. Primary reason I switched is I can run ISTA/D in Win 10. What OS are you running INPA in?

This is a good question, both programs work and both bleed the system, ISTA/D is sequential bleed process that you have to manually run each step, INPA offers a more holistic approach, it does all the steps on its own and at the end asking you to press the break pedal (and hold) to start the car (ISTA/D never did this) - I believe (i have no facts to back me up on this other than how much smoother my car is shifting) that its within this step that makes the difference - Technically, both systems use the same data files so it should be the same.

Another thing to note is that ISTA/D puts more stress on the pump, for its bleed processes it always tries to prime the pump over and over for a period of a few seconds and lets air out before actually starting the bleed process (which is understandable) - INPA does this but its not way near as much as ISTA, its also worth mentioning that INPA works in reverse of ISTA, its bleed processes and adaptations are the exact reverse.

Since you are in the middle of this with ISTA/D, i invite you to test it out, perform the full bleed/adaptation with ISTA get all the air out, then try the adaptation with INPA.

Im currently running windows 7 x64bit and running version 5.0.6 of INPA.

Hope this helps!

[robgill]

Hey Irhase46m3 , thx for the post. Very timely for me, I have just finished relocating my pump with the BE kit and I'm in the process of bleeding. I have done a few successful bleeds with ISTA/D and will now do some more with the pump horizontal. Can you share more detail on why the ISTA/D bleed is different/worse than INPA? I gave up on INPA a few years ago and and haven't had any issue with ISTA/D. Primary reason I switched is I can run ISTA/D in Win 10. What OS are you running INPA in?