Carbon Driveshaft

[Epsilon]

I don't believe any of the talk with the carbon driveshafts got carried over from M3F and probably not too many folks have experience with them.

It did pick my interest and I would like to hear more folks talk about it. From what I remember, a minority of the folks had a bad experience with the JFiber carbon DS group buy which ran for $1300? One guy with a supercharger experienced vibrations over 100+ mph and even had a warranty replacement which still occurred. I think someone mentioned that JFiber's tests didn't run the DS at a very high RPM during balancing. Maybe someone can fill the gaps.

There was a 2nd groupbuy by YCW and they couldn't get enough folks to join due to the 1st GB and obviously the price. If there's enough interest again, I can ask them. They are supposedly on a 2nd gen and improved. I think they needed like 20 people and price was about $1200-$1300 shipped with warranty.

[Obioban]

There's been 3 different CF driveshafts for the e46 M3 at this point, and all of them have been vibrating garbage. I think until a new shaft on the market is proven (multiple customers running them over an extended period of time) to be good, they should just be avoided.

So running a GB on a new, unproven shaft seems like a bad idea.

[BBRTuning]

For what it's worth, I bought a used CF driveshaft from a friend, who ordered it custom from a local shop Driveshaft Pro in Los Angeles. It's not super light, it uses a short steel shaft section on both ends before transitioning to CF - I'm not sure what's a normal weight for these, but if I remember correctly, I weighed it at 13lb vs. stock at 26.5lb. Absolutely zero vibration or any noises even at 130+ mph.

However, even with 4.10 gears, a light twin-disc clutch etc, I didn't really notice much of a difference at all. There's slightly less backlash in the drivetrain (getting on/off gas rapidly at lower RPM) but there's still quite a bit compared to say a Porsche or something without a driveshaft at all. Maybe 1st gear feels a bit more responsive, although with the power I'm making now and 4.10 gears, in 1st gear you're on the rev limiter instantly once you're at WOT anyway. It's one of those parts where I threw it in and honestly forgot I even installed it by the next day. Maybe that's a good thing though.

If you think about the entire rotating powertrain as a whole (once in-gear and clutch engaged), which includes the entire engine rotating assembly, clutch assembly, transmission, driveshaft, differential, axles, and wheels/tires, just saving 12-15lb from the driveshaft is a very small percentage of total rotating powertrain inertia. Not saying it's pointless, plenty of high end sports/supercars use CF shafts, but it's probably one of the last mods you should do on these cars IMO.

[Arith2]

It's not the first mod people should be doing. Probably the last. A flywheel can be lightened the same amount for almost a third of the price basically.

[Epoustouflant]

I am bumping this up as I am connected to Mfactory and have organized a 100 member + group buy in E9X world. I was targeting an ultimate response drivetrain and paired this with TTV’s lightweight billet carbon steel flywheel, now looking at final drive upgrades

Their driveshaft are vibration free and the gold standard in our community due to a unique flange mechanism. They are OEM provider for TRD and Ford Performance.

Read more about it here: https://euroconnex.co/collections/e4...veshaft-e46-m3

I am aware bridges were burned with a Jfiber saga, but couldn’t find the story itself.

What happened?

I could easily arrange a group buy or early adopter special for the E46. The GB price was 1,049 + shipping in E9X world, they retail for 1,499 and I’ve been able to secure a 1,349 community price year long.

[Acetech]

Obi,
I’m aware of the early cf driveshaft VAC sold was a vibrator and several complaints on the Jfiber and the driveshaft shop shaft but I can’t recall anyone posting about the M factory YCW shaft having vibration issues. There was only the first GB on these and that was it, J fiber came next and sucked up all the buyers that left a second GB from M factory a no go.
And I never saw any M factory shafts used for sale.

Did anyone confirm there were issues with the M factory shaft?

[WuBai]

OP,

I was involved with the whole CF driveshaft. The first iteration from YCW was in tandem with JFiber and those units were scarce with some reporting vibration and others like myself being vibration free. There was a falling out between Michael and YCW and the JFiber folks. Michael claimed that the hub that JFiber used was from YCW and when I visited the JFiber factory, they said that was a complete fabrication on Michael's part and that the hubs were made in house. Michael from YCW continued to claim that JFiber was not being honest and that JFiber had a limited inventory of the YCW hubs and once they were done with those, that they would not be replenishing via YCW.

Fast forward a few sets through the old M3F JFiber group by, and lo and behold the hub was a different color than the YCW ones. Michael was correct and not misleading, J-Fiber did not make their own hubs inhouse and Michael's concern was that their design would not withstand the stressed the DS would be exposed to in the long run. So as Michael was designing his updated DS, JFiber was selling their own driveshafts using YCW hubs and claiming them as their own. Not good.

I've put about 50 miles on the M3 since my installation, and that was three years ago. Luckily I had one with Michael's hub and haven't had issues with vibration.

Personally, if I had to purchase a driveshaft right now, I would purchase the one from Michael and YCW. They brought over the old engineer from JFiber and have an updated and more robust hub that would be less likely to fail. Have I tested it? Nope but judging from the fact that YCW had actually been CORRECT with what they said and JFiber was actually misleading and fooling me the entire time, I wouldn't take a chance with them based on that lack of honesty alone.

If my DS ever fails, I will be purchasing a new one from Michael, as long as he would be willing to forgive me for not trusting him about JFiber.

[stash1]

OP,

I was involved with the whole CF driveshaft. The first iteration from YCW was in tandem with JFiber and those units were scarce with some reporting vibration and others like myself being vibration free. There was a falling out between Michael and YCW and the JFiber folks. Michael claimed that the hub that JFiber used was from YCW and when I visited the JFiber factory, they said that was a complete fabrication on Michael's part and that the hubs were made in house. Michael from YCW continued to claim that JFiber was not being honest and that JFiber had a limited inventory of the YCW hubs and once they were done with those, that they would not be replenishing via YCW.

Fast forward a few sets through the old M3F JFiber group by, and lo and behold the hub was a different color than the YCW ones. Michael was correct and not misleading, J-Fiber did not make their own hubs inhouse and Michael's concern was that their design would not withstand the stressed the DS would be exposed to in the long run. So as Michael was designing his updated DS, JFiber was selling their own driveshafts using YCW hubs and claiming them as their own. Not good.

I've put about 50 miles on the M3 since my installation, and that was three years ago. Luckily I had one with Michael's hub and haven't had issues with vibration.

Personally, if I had to purchase a driveshaft right now, I would purchase the one from Michael and YCW. They brought over the old engineer from JFiber and have an updated and more robust hub that would be less likely to fail. Have I tested it? Nope but judging from the fact that YCW had actually been CORRECT with what they said and JFiber was actually misleading and fooling me the entire time, I wouldn't take a chance with them based on that lack of honesty alone.

If my DS ever fails, I will be purchasing a new one from Michael, as long as he would be willing to forgive me for not trusting him about JFiber.

Just to add a couple of things to this saga as I dealt w/Michael/YCW first hand, and was also the BETA tester for the original cf d/s GB that fell through. That d/s is still in my car w/approximately 15k mi on it now, and has performed flawlessly since day one. It's been tested up to 160+ on the streets of Mexico, and I don't care what anyone says...the car revs quicker (i.e. has better throttle response), and the drivetrain feels 'calmer' (I believe due to the intrinsic dampening qualities of cf). The above is correct, and what I originally shared on the old M3F, and w/others who reached out to me either through PM's or personally. I tried to start up another GB w/the updated YCW d/s on the old M3F, but due to the drama and confusion over the previous GB, couldn't find the necessary buyers required for Michael to produce the d/s. I stopped communicating w/Michael about 2 yrs ago, so I'm not sure where YCW is currently, w/regards to producing the 'new' d/s for the E46 platform. I could always try reaching out again if there was enough interest, but it seems that the 'want' mostly died after the original GB was over...and I feel like the owner dynamic/demographic has further changed (could be wrong?) since then as well maybe?

[WuBai]

Stash - Regardless of setting up a GB, can users still purchase one of his driveshafts with the updated design? There might be some still lurking that would love this as a finishing touch. I can also vouch that the ride is much smoother, quieter and revs easier with the driveshaft. In the future, I wouldn't mind even purchasing one from YCW just to try it out as an experiment and compare it to his first design which has worked so well in both of our vehicles.

[Acetech]

I’ve never been able to shake my desire for a carbon fiber driveshaft
If M factory can make a vibration free reliable driveshaft I would consider getting one.

[ra2fanatic]

I reached out to them when they did their GB for the E9X community a few months back. They wouldn't make an exception for an E46 for the GB price. If someone brought it back up, yeah sure, I'm in.

[Epoustouflant]

I appreciate the clarifications, this matches my discussions with Michael regarding J Fiber.

I can organize this. I've helped Michael sell 100 + of these to E9X M3 owners. I talk to him on a daily basis. I already have a special for E9X and E46 M3 owners at 1,349 + shipping instead of 1,499 + shipping. GB price I negotiated on E9X was 1049 + shipping.

I just launched euroconnex.co today - would run it using this platform and extend to all E46 M3 groups.

[Obioban]

Drive shafts are, on some time frame, a wear item. If this gets proven out by happy customers, I’d get one next time I wear one out.

[EthanolTurbo]

Sign me up for a carbon fiber driveshaft.

[stash1]

Stash - Regardless of setting up a GB, can users still purchase one of his driveshafts with the updated design? There might be some still lurking that would love this as a finishing touch. I can also vouch that the ride is much smoother, quieter and revs easier with the driveshaft. In the future, I wouldn't mind even purchasing one from YCW just to try it out as an experiment and compare it to his first design which has worked so well in both of our vehicles.

Hey brother, the last conversation that I had w/him, he mentioned that he wouldn't even tool up for an E46 version until he had 20 confirmed buyers. Like I said, I've been out of the loop, so I'm completely unaware if they ever produced the 'new updated' version of the E46 d/s? Yep, I told him that I would BETA the updated version as well...if they produced it.