Agreed upon value insurance policies

[sina]

Not me

I use my car pretty much exactly as you do and have been trying to get an agreed value policy for years now, but as soon as I mention not owning another car, I get told to go away. All the insurance companies I've talked to seem to believe that it's impossible to survive in the US without using a car as your main method of transportation.

Yeah, that's really lame. There must be a decent amount of urban folk who live a more European or New York-type lifestyle where you do most of your errands by foot and only use the car for pleasure or day trips, etc. I do live very close to some family, so I'm wondering if maybe I can get on my mom's insurance policy and count that as a daily or something along those lines. I'm not too well versed in the insurance world, but would be cool if something like that worked, and the price probably wouldn't work out to be too bad, judging by the types of rates people in this thread are getting.

[jet_dogg]

I'm not sure why you guys are getting upset over their policy. They clearly state it must be a second vehicle and you guys are getting mad it's not your second vehicle.

[LSBNick]

Just did some finagling to get my vehicles under hagerty. With a lot of work and persistence I managed to get the LSB and the e92 on hagerty. Never in my life have I wished to be 30 years old than I did when I called Hagerty lol

[su45]

They actually say it must be your third vehicle if you have a spouse. Very recently called Grundy, Hagerty, JC Taylor, and Assurant/Geico and all of them said that both my fiancee and I would need separate daily drivers to insure the M3. That's three cars for one agreed value policy.

Two is understandable--we already have a shitbox Corolla that's essentially a bumper car for getting groceries. They said we both need a DD. Neither of us ever drive to work and there are millions of people in a similar situation in NY, DC, SF, Boston, etc.

The lady at Grundy said they've tried to explain this to the underwriters numerous times to no avail.

[Fresh1179]

This is somewhat off-topic, but here is a personal experience tip from a lawyer. Buy as much UM/UIM on your policy as you can. If you live in a State where you have the option of purchasing stacked UIM coverage, do it. UIM/UM is the cheapest life insurance you can buy. This coverage is also the least profitable risk assumption your carrier makes so the agents/resellers don’t talk about it that much. Because people don’t talk about it a lot, most people do not understand it. Hell, it is confusing (more so the exact legal intricacies) enough to lawyers that they release an updated 400-600 page guide for lawyers in every State, every year. This is how it works in general:

Quick UIM Example: Tim hits you and puts You in the hospital. You wanted to save $100 a year so You bought a policy with $100,000 in underinsured motorists coverage (UIM). You require extensive medical care and incur medical bills and lost wages in the amount of $200,000 (let’s make it easy). Well, as it turns out, Tim bought the state minimum policy to get insured and has $30,000 in liability insurance. Your UIM kicks in and you recover the full $100,000 (30k from Tim and $70k from Your insurance) limits. You incurred $200,000 worth of damages and you have $100,000 worth of coverage. Now, a lawyer will take a third, you will mandatorily have to pay back your health insurer to satisfy the medical lien because of third party liability so they take another $16,666 (at a minimum) and you are now left with a true amount of $50,000 in recovery for that $200,000 incident you had.

What about UM? Just means they can't locate the driver or the driver is totally uninsured. Same principles apply for both UIM and UM.

What is UIM/UM Stacking?

Intrapolicy Stacking: Your State allows intrapolicy stacking. Your broker should know this or you should get another one. Same facts as above but assume that Your State by statute or purchase allows intrapolicy stacking. Same incident occurs as above but you have purchased or are statutorily entitled to intrapolicy stacking. In this example, you have 3 cars on your policy. The UIM/UM coverage for each vehicle "stacks" to a total of $300,000 (Vehicle 1-$100,000+Vehicle 2-$100,000+Vehicle 3 $100,000.) Now, Your total UIM/UM insurance coverage for the incident is $300,000.

Interpolicy Stacking: Your State does not allow intrapolicy stacking, but does allow interpolicy stacking. Your broker should know this or you should get another one. Same facts as above but assume You have one policy with Carrier X with 5 cars. You also have one policy with Carrier Y (Can be same carrier, as long as policies are different). Same facts as above, but for your 5 car policy with Carrier X, you purchased $250,000 in UIM. For your policy with Carrier Y, you purchased UM/UIM limits in the amount of $100,000. In this instance, the vehicles do not intrastack on your policy with Carrier X (remember, no intrapolicy stacking) so you have $250,000 in coverage from Carrier X, however, your policy with Carrier X will most likely interstack with your policy with Carrier Y. Your total UIM/UM coverage for this incident is $350,000 ($250,000-Carrier X Policy+$100,000 Carrier Y Policy)

Why Are the Numbers Written Like $100,000/$300,000, $250,000/$500,000 etc.
The first number is PER PERSON, meaning the first number is the maximum coverage per person. The second number is PER INCIDENT. You may have multiple individuals entitled to coverage in your vehicle. If you have 4 individuals in the vehicle the total insurance available for FOR ALL CLAIMS ARISING OUT OF THE INCIDENT is limited to the second number.

Buy as much UIM/UM as you can afford. Check what you have. Now. This IS NOT legal advice but in my personal, experienced opinion UIM/UM insurance is the best insurance you can own, especially for those 25-45. If you are under the age of about 45 and have life insurance but shitty UIM/UM coverage, you are doing it wrong. Ask yourself this question. Am I more likely to die of a sudden, unforeseen medical emergency in my middle age or get injured or die in a car wreck? I'll let you make that determination. If you need to find out what you have, find or ask for a copy of your “declarations page.” Make sure your policy is suitable for yourself and your family. This is the most important aspect of your car insurance. Period.

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[JayVee]

$25,000 Agreed upon cash value. Some restrictions like mileage and overnight trips. I pay about $550/year.

[thegenius46m]

Hmm... Am I overpaying? Lol. I have my M3 on $70k agreed value policy with Hagerty under the "modified-motorsports" classification since the car does see track time and is far from stock to justify solely "classic collector" usage. Liability is 500/500/500 with a 1k deductible and I have the option to get the car back for free in the event of a total loss. Paying $2600/yr for comprehensive and collision. Driving record is spotless.

[Fresh1179]

Hmm... Am I overpaying? Lol. I have my M3 on $70k agreed value policy with Hagerty under the "modified-motorsports" classification since the car does see track time and is far from stock to justify solely "classic collector" usage. Liability is 500/500/500 with a 1k deductible and I have the option to get the car back for free in the event of a total loss. Paying $2600/yr for comprehensive and collision. Driving record is spotless.

I would confirm that your coverage extends to HPDE’s/track events. If it does, then that is a steal. HPDE insurance alone from Hagerty for 4/5 events a year could easily add up to this amount alone.

The liability insurance amount is solid. I’m assuming the UIM is also the same which is solid. If you drive the car on the street a lot this is honestly not terrible. You can try to bring down the yearly cost by asking about increasing your deductible to save some money.

I don’t have the language memorized, but %99 of policies will contain language that essentially says [the carrier] will not pay for damages caused or incurred during caused by racing etc. These clauses often don’t include information about HPDE, which is arguably a driver school…It’s a nuanced argument but it is often successful so more carriers are adjusting this language. It’s also an agreed upon value of 70k, which is what you would get for like a 2 year old S550 so the underlying amount of coverage is high. Check with Hagerty to make sure the policy specifically includes track events. If it does…PM the agent you worked with haha.


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[thegenius46m]

I would confirm that your coverage extends to HPDE’s/track events. If it does, then that is a steal. HPDE insurance alone from Hagerty for 4/5 events a year could easily add up to this amount alone.

The liability insurance amount is solid. I’m assuming the UIM is also the same which is solid. If you drive the car on the street a lot this is honestly not terrible. You can try to bring down the yearly cost by asking about increasing your deductible to save some money.

I don’t have the language memorized, but %99 of policies will contain language that essentially says [the carrier] will not pay for damages caused or incurred during caused by racing etc. These clauses often don’t include information about HPDE, which is arguably a driver school…It’s a nuanced argument but it is often successful so more carriers are adjusting this language. It’s also an agreed upon value of 70k, which is what you would get for like a 2 year old S550 so the underlying amount of coverage is high. Check with Hagerty to make sure the policy specifically includes track events. If it does…PM the agent you worked with haha.


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Track insurance is still separate per event so yes it will add up VERY quick. I would not be surprised if events are $800-1000 a day between the cost of the event and the supplemental insurance. Been around the scene too long and personally witnessed too many total losses from a minor "oops" or fluid spill by someone else that its literally not worth the risk anymore.

The M3 is a 3rd vehicle for me so usage is now strictly for fun, but that usage is higher risk so I maxed out liability because at the end of the day it is not worth being sued if you hit a hypercar on a backroad in a freak incident because that is EASILY over 100k in damages to just the other guy.

I know my policy is not like others given how high the coverage is, but curious if I'm overpaying or it's right in line? Wouldn't be opposed to saving some money if I need to grind them next year, but the peace of mind with all the other variables already being taken care of made it worth it. Outside of separate hpde insurance for events I am pretty much covered under any usage circumstance unlike some of the cheaper guys who will grind you for parking in a public parking lot and getting keyed where they will deny you because its out of policy. Lol.

[BlueBimmers]

Happy with Hagerty, $850 per year for 06 M3 and 02 M5, 250/500 coverage. Three car family. If Hagerty is giving E92s agreed value coverage wonder why they are not included in Valuation reports.

[jrgatfh]

Just insured my 05 M3 45k miles with State Farm (Classic Car Division) for $75k, for little less than $1k per yr.

Not really any restrictions just can't be an everyday car.

[lvm3sm46]

jrgatfh Did you have to go through an agent or can you get quote online? Thats a good rate.

[Tonggi]

Nope. Moment I hit hot pits, coverage is off. In the paddock I’m good.

I checked Hagerty and they seem to offer track insurance now. I seem to hit all their restrictions so I think I will start looking for quotes, If I can knock 2 birds with one stone by lowering my insurance and getting track insurance at the same time, that is a win win!

I have Grundy. $60,000 agreed value on the M3, $40,000 on the M5, up to 5000 miles per year for each. It’s costing me ~half what normal insurance was costing me before I switched over, and that wouldn’t pay out nearly as much, so win win… unless I want to drive more than 5000 miles.

What track insurance do you get?

Getting an insurance broker has been one of my favorite things I've done. I never deal with insurance companies anymore-- he handles it all for me, at no expense to me. And he consistently gets me lower rates than I was ever getting for myself.

Really, though, it's just so much less painful. When I sold my house on Monday I just sent him a text telling him to get rid of the home owners insurance. He did all the paperwork and just emailed me a link to digitally sign. When I wanted agreed upon value insurance, I just texted him-- he did all the price comparing, paperwork, etc, and emailed me a link where all I had to do is sign. Last year when my license cleared of old tickets he renegotiated all my insurance rates, unprompted, to get me lower rates.

Cheaper, easier, and almost certainly better done (as presumably he's more competent at insurance stuff than me). I have zero intention of ever going back to dealing with my own insurance.

Got a name you can send along? Sounds awesome unless they are state specific

[Fresh1179]

I checked Hagerty and they seem to offer track insurance now. I seem to hit all their restrictions so I think I will start looking for quotes, If I can knock 2 birds with one stone by lowering my insurance and getting track insurance at the same time, that is a win win!




What track insurance do you get?




Got a name you can send along? Sounds awesome unless they are state specific

Are you talking about a policy that expressly includes insurance for the track, or is a yearly track day policy? Sounds too good to be true? If they were smart, which they are, they would sell these base policies with an offer of %25 off track day insurance or something like that. A hell of a lot of people, including myself, would switch over for that reason alone. I would be interested to see if Hagerty is a licensed carrier or their policies are underwritten by someone else. I’ll check the NCCOI to see in a moment. All the carriers will tell you your 05’ Comp Package with a slicktop and manual is worth $8,000 when they send out their adjuster after an incident. You have the right to an independent appraiser of your own btw, which would be a prudent move given the “niche value” of our cars. %99 of the time it doesn’t really matter, but in the event of damage they are appraising the vehicle against current market values, which are….elevated. If you are thinking about changing your carriers or policy, I would humbly suggest, and this is only my two cents:

Tier 1: USAA (if you are eligible)

Tier 2: Erie, Farm Bureau

Tier 3: State Farm

Tier 4: Geico, Progressive

Tier 5: AllSnake

Tier 6: Insurance presented by Shaq (National General, Integon


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[nuc1]

If you are thinking about changing your carriers or policy, I would humbly suggest, and this is only my two cents:

Tier 1: USAA (if you are eligible)

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USAA:
I've been a member since 2000. If you are separated from the military (not retired, not active duty), their policies/prices aren't all that great. And their customer service has taken a notable dive in the past 5 - 7 years. Between my house insurance and vehicle insurance, they are easily twice the price for inferior coverage. I have since moved all insurance to other companies.

Mike