Flashing the MK60 with ZCP software

[yuba]

Actually not true. It will work in his case and he just needs to program the m3 parameters manually on his sedan. I literally have had this on my 05 ZHP sedan MK60 with full CSL parameters for the past 2 years now and it is epic and does fully work. I think the only issue you may run into with the non-m module on a m3 is that the unit even with vin correction, it may not allow you to flash to default M3 settings from the VO without fully virginizing the unit, because NCS will recognize it as a non-m module. Even then, a non-m MK60 with manually programmed CSL parameters is FAR superior than an MK20 ever will be.

Plus there are a handful of S54 swapped sedans with the MK60 that came with the non-m shell that are working just fine so it can be done. It just wont be a walk in the park without a firmware flash I imagine, but still very doable.

So, this is interesting. I'm coming at this from the side of having figured out how to code a M3 unit to CSL params without anything but the module since I ran one in a turbo Miata race car. I ended up creating a SSD file that matches the VIN of the unit and then was able to download the config on the unit with NCSExpert, edit it to set CSL via NCSDummy, and then write the settings back onto the unit with NCSExpert.

Are you saying that you're able to set the BAUART_MK60 setting to CSL on non-M units?

As far as actually flash, it is the 813.3 and 817.3 units that can be bench flashed with Continental Race software, whereas the 818.3 cannot. People are also flashing MK60E1 units (unknown revision number right now) and 860.3 and 870.3 MK60E5 units from the M3 with Continental software.

[Bry5on]

Can confirm the above, my s54 wagon worked on both the non-m and M3 MK60. I didn’t use the M specs in my non-m MK60 though as I wasn’t aware at the time that writing changes outside of NCS was an option. It is much better with m-track mode and M3 settings now, which is basically my default driving mode.

[thegenius46m]

This will not work. These Mk60 units have different „mappings“ for the ABS/DSC interventions inside like a engine control unit. Only a very partnumbers few can be flashed and only very very few people know how and keep this secret.

Actually not true. It will work in his case and he just needs to program the m3 parameters manually on his sedan. I literally have had this on my 05 ZHP sedan MK60 with full CSL parameters for the past 2 years now and it is epic and does fully work. I think the only issue you may run into with the non-m module on a m3 is that the unit even with vin correction, it may not allow you to flash to default M3 settings from the VO without fully virginizing the unit, because NCS will recognize it as a non-m module. Even then, a non-m MK60 with manually programmed CSL parameters is FAR superior than an MK20 ever will be.

Plus there are a handful of S54 swapped sedans with the MK60 that came with the non-m shell that are working just fine so it can be done. It just wont be a walk in the park without a firmware flash I imagine, but still very doable.

[S54B32]

So my 2003.5 e46 sedan has an 811.3 and I also have a spare 820.3 mk60. It's currently without an engine, but once I get that sorted I'll work on trying to program my mk60 with the ZCP parameters. Correct me if I'm wrong, but I think all mk60 are basically the same, it's just the programming that is different. Here is a list of ZHP vs M3 vs ZCP/CSL mk60 default software settings (see below), so hopefully with INPA I can just program it and call it done. It would be great if that was the case, since I paid almost nothing for the 820.3 and real M3/ZCP are literally 10x the price.

https://liam821.com/MK60-Comparison.pdf

This will not work. These Mk60 units have different „mappings“ for the ABS/DSC interventions inside like a engine control unit. Only a very partnumbers few can be flashed and only very very few people know how and keep this secret.

[liam821]

I haven’t had a chance to do anything but I did pickup a non-m 820.3 MK60 last weekend for r&d that I’m happy to donate to the cause if anyone wants to experiment with the board? Bry5on let me know.

So my 2003.5 e46 sedan has an 811.3 and I also have a spare 820.3 mk60. It's currently without an engine, but once I get that sorted I'll work on trying to program my mk60 with the ZCP parameters. Correct me if I'm wrong, but I think all mk60 are basically the same, it's just the programming that is different. Here is a list of ZHP vs M3 vs ZCP/CSL mk60 default software settings (see below), so hopefully with INPA I can just program it and call it done. It would be great if that was the case, since I paid almost nothing for the 820.3 and real M3/ZCP are literally 10x the price.

https://liam821.com/MK60-Comparison.pdf

[thegenius46m]

Looks like you're local so if you change your mind lmk and I can hand it off lol.

[Bry5on]

I’ve been slacking on this one, instead focusing on converting my interior color, refreshing everything in the suspension and doing the CSL treatment to the engine. For now, I won’t be of too much help until I’m through the last of that work. A good winter project

In the meantime, I installed an intensive washer wiper switch to make triggering the existing DSC much less painful

[thegenius46m]

I haven’t had a chance to do anything but I did pickup a non-m 820.3 MK60 last weekend for r&d that I’m happy to donate to the cause if anyone wants to experiment with the board? Bry5on let me know.

Also for anyone wondering, here is the list of non-m MK60 variants with their part numbers if you’re looking for one. Very useful

https://www.e46fanatics.com/threads/how-to-change-abs-asc-control-module-trifecta-5df5-error-e46.1275927/

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[liam821]

I'm just starting another project and would love to have the one-touch mtrack via pin-38 on my non-m mk60 unit. Any update on getting this working thegenius46m?

[thegenius46m]

Any chance you logged ECU->Cluster CAN ID 339 (0x153) when enabling M-track mode? bit offset 62 (last byte, second to last bit) Indicates to the cluster to illuminate M-track mode. AFAIK this CAN message is sent via the ECU. So maybe M-track mode is being enabled in the MK60 but the ECU is not forwarding the message to the cluster.

I have not logged actually but I am also convinced the button press is not telling the cluster to illuminate the indicator on the non-m cluster. What are you using to log?

Are you referring to function "dtc_lampe" set to aktiv in the mk60? That is the function that tells the cluster to turn on the m track indicator. You also need to enable "Anzegie_hochladen" to aktiv in the cluster for the indictor to illuminate. On the m3 this works as intended, but on my ZHP that has the non-m mk60, when coded the same way my non-m cluster (the newest and final e46 cluster variant) with the m track led soldered and confirmed working via cluster test, the dsc button press does not tell the cluster to illuminate the mtrack indicator. On the ZHP I have dtc_lampe set to nicht_aktiv so it uses the normal non-m lighting combination to trigger dsc off indicator as m track and dsc off + yellow brake light as full dsc off.

I agree with you that something in the mk60 is not communicating the button press to the cluster for m track to illuminate with the non-m module. I'm convinced it is either a missing resistor or firmware difference. It's definitely the mk60 though because when my zhp cluster has the anzegie_hochladen function turned on (to illuminate m track mode indicator) it is expecting the function pass to illuminate the indicator on a single press of the dsc button but nothing illuminates on the cluster side. I believe press and hold does illuminate the dsc off indicator only on full traction off so the mk60 is switching modes it just cant tell the cluster to turn on the indicator from the non-m module.

But I think we're close to figuring this out if we can figure out what pin on the mk60 triggers the indicator to the cluster and replicate it on the non-m module. Curious what you can confirm with pin 38 and pin 39 on the non-m module compared to an m3 mk60 and replicate the m3 module (zcp preferred) to a non-m module.

[eacmen]

So non-m cars, tpms was optional unlike m3 where it is standard so you probably got the donor non-m mk60 unit from a non tpms car? Just looked and that appears to be the case because the non-m tpms retrofit has you add in pin 40 to the module.

http://www.zhpmafia.com/forums/showthread.php?11072-OEM-TPMS-Retrofit-The-full-package-doityourself

Can you try swapping the resistor on pin 38 to a 14.1k ohm and see what that does? I'm curious if that is indeed the missing link for adding the M track functionality. Would confirm what NZ stated above too.

But... I believe non-m may have at least one other difference because I had the m track led added to my 05 zhp cluster and it is confirmed working via cluster test. After recoding the mk60 and cluster to illuminate the m track indictor when engaged on the non-m just like my M3 is using, the cluster does not see the button press to illuminate the m track indicator but m track does indeed get triggered. On the non-m I am using one touch dsc off indicator for m track and dsc off + yellow brake light for full dsc off. After comparing the circuitry there are no real differences that I could determine between the m3 and non-m leading up to the mk60 module itself so there may be a second pin on the non-m module that is different to m3 and zcp.

Any chance you logged ECU->Cluster CAN ID 339 (0x153) when enabling M-track mode? bit offset 62 (last byte, second to last bit) Indicates to the cluster to illuminate M-track mode. AFAIK this CAN message is sent via the ECU. So maybe M-track mode is being enabled in the MK60 but the ECU is not forwarding the message to the cluster.

[thegenius46m]

Thanks to TropicalM3 who had both a ZCP and M DSC available, we’ve got measurements for both, and the non-M looks to be similar to the M for pin 38.



I noted that on my non-m module, pin 40 (the TPMS pin) is shorted directly to ground as that was the only other difference I knew of that might be hardware related.

In summary, measured to ground at pin 38 for m-track:
non-M: ~3.2k ohm
M3: ~3.2k ohm
ZCP: ~14.1k ohm

this may imply that there’s not enough resistance in the M and non-M units to pull down the IC pin when grounded. Fear not, this is measurable.

Next up I’ll power up my non-M unit on the bench, measure voltage at the IC pin associated with pin 38, then pull pin 38 down to ground and measure what happens at the IC pin. The IC likely has an internal pull up resistor of some value that can be calculated after this experiment.

So non-m cars, tpms was optional unlike m3 where it is standard so you probably got the donor non-m mk60 unit from a non tpms car? Just looked and that appears to be the case because the non-m tpms retrofit has you add in pin 40 to the module.

http://www.zhpmafia.com/forums/showthread.php?11072-OEM-TPMS-Retrofit-The-full-package-doityourself

Can you try swapping the resistor on pin 38 to a 14.1k ohm and see what that does? I'm curious if that is indeed the missing link for adding the M track functionality. Would confirm what NZ stated above too.

But... I believe non-m may have at least one other difference because I had the m track led added to my 05 zhp cluster and it is confirmed working via cluster test. After recoding the mk60 and cluster to illuminate the m track indictor when engaged on the non-m just like my M3 is using, the cluster does not see the button press to illuminate the m track indicator but m track does indeed get triggered. On the non-m I am using one touch dsc off indicator for m track and dsc off + yellow brake light for full dsc off. After comparing the circuitry there are no real differences that I could determine between the m3 and non-m leading up to the mk60 module itself so there may be a second pin on the non-m module that is different to m3 and zcp.

[Bry5on]

Following with interest...

Also, this group may have some knowledge for the project: https://www.facebook.com/groups/1056638784424876

Thank you. Sadly, I do not have a Facebook account. If there’s anyone here that has good info, I’d appreciate it being shared here!

[George Hill]

Following with interest...

Also, this group may have some knowledge for the project: https://www.facebook.com/groups/1056638784424876

[Bry5on]

Thanks to TropicalM3 who had both a ZCP and M DSC available, we’ve got measurements for both, and the non-M looks to be similar to the M for pin 38.

With the ZCP Module and the positive cable on 37 I got on 38-14.1, on 39-8.7 and on 40-18.4. With the Negative set on 37 I got on 38-16.2, on 39-8.7 and 40-19.8.

With the Non-ZCP positive on 37 I got on 38-3.2, 0n 39-8.8 and on 40-19.5. With the negative set on 37, on 38 I got 3.2, on 39-8.8 and on 40 I got 22.5.

I noted that on my non-m module, pin 40 (the TPMS pin) is shorted directly to ground as that was the only other difference I knew of that might be hardware related.

In summary, measured to ground at pin 38 for m-track:
non-M: ~3.2k ohm
M3: ~3.2k ohm
ZCP: ~14.1k ohm

this may imply that there’s not enough resistance in the M and non-M units to pull down the IC pin when grounded. Fear not, this is measurable.

Next up I’ll power up my non-M unit on the bench, measure voltage at the IC pin associated with pin 38, then pull pin 38 down to ground and measure what happens at the IC pin. The IC likely has an internal pull up resistor of some value that can be calculated after this experiment.