CSL airbox vs throttle response/low rpm torque

[Ramps]

I just slapped in a Kassel CSL converted DME and MAP sensor with a CSL air rail and I get pretty severe bucking when trying to "floor" it... low end torque also seems to be lacking a bit, but then maybe I was expecting kick you in your pants pulling like everyone says they feel.

David

I had very odd behavior with their converted DME as well, so i had HTE do a remote tune a few days later and he said the tune they put on there was for race cams and had knock sensors turned off. Thankfully I didn’t drive it much with their tune. The HTE tune fixed everything and the car drives better than stock now, no hesitation anywhere, lots of power. So my reco is to get it retuned.

[lemoose]

I just slapped in a Kassel CSL converted DME and MAP sensor with a CSL air rail and I get pretty severe bucking when trying to "floor" it... low end torque also seems to be lacking a bit, but then maybe I was expecting kick you in your pants pulling like everyone says they feel.

David

Something is wrong. I have a non-HP to HP + CSL (kassel) converted DME with MAP sensor tapped into the brake booster line (non-csl rail) and don't have any bucking in any condition nor any apparent loss of torque anywhere in the rev range. I do, however, have the idle hunting issue which for me only occurs on warm starts and resolves itself as soon as you put the car in gear and let it roll a couple feet

[Avedis]

I just slapped in a Kassel CSL converted DME and MAP sensor with a CSL air rail and I get pretty severe bucking when trying to "floor" it... low end torque also seems to be lacking a bit, but then maybe I was expecting kick you in your pants pulling like everyone says they feel.

David

I encourage you (and anyone not happy with how their CSL airbox equipped car runs) to read about Bryson's Mullet tune:

https://nam3forum.com/forums/forum/main-forum/member-build-journals/195928-black-tan-332it?p=260311#post260311

and these reviews:

https://nam3forum.com/forums/forum/main-forum/member-build-journals/173296-trent-s-s54-rebuild-and-sedan-swap?p=272432#post272432

https://nam3forum.com/forums/forum/main-forum/member-build-journals/217513-immaculate-low-mileage-2004-silver-grey-csl-inspired-build?p=284327#post284327

[davidinnyc]

I just slapped in a Kassel CSL converted DME and MAP sensor with a CSL air rail and I get pretty severe bucking when trying to "floor" it... low end torque also seems to be lacking a bit, but then maybe I was expecting kick you in your pants pulling like everyone says they feel.

David

[D-O]

I think his car is Dinan S3-R so supercharger kit no CSL intake

Ah. Thanks.

[Sharocks]

I don't want to start a big thing, but my car has been tuned 4 times by Hassan, and I haven't been happy with a single one. Granted, my car isn't your average CSL intake car, but I expected more given the nutsack riding that goes on here.

I'm used to tuners spending a few hours on the dyno, and then doing a street tune to really nail down the part throttle. My car bucks hard under toe in, and there's other issues as well. I'm not saying HTE doesn't produce good tunes, but I've always questioned the efficacy of remote tuning.

I bought an AEM standalone I plan to switch to in the future.

You have a boosted car.

That's completely different from what we are discussing here.

If you want it to be perfect, then you will have to spend hours on the dyno, street log and tune and then back on the dyno and possibly throw some more parts at it.

That's how it goes with boost.

NA is much more simple.

I'm not looking forward to tuning my S3-R either.

[EthanolTurbo]

It drives really great if it's tuned right and has a MAP. I noticed no loss of low end vs my previous MAF setup.

[Gt4]

Mass Air Flow sensor? Did not know you could use one with the CSL intake.

A CSL intake has always been part of the plan, but threads like this make me wonder just how big a gamble I am taking. These days we are talking something like $4k for this upgrade. Too much to end up unhappy.

I think his car is Dinan S3-R so supercharger kit no CSL intake

[inlinesix123]

Mass Air Flow sensor? Did not know you could use one with the CSL intake.

A CSL intake has always been part of the plan, but threads like this make me wonder just how big a gamble I am taking. These days we are talking something like $4k for this upgrade. Too much to end up unhappy.

Just get a proper MAP conversion, the box is a joy to drive.

[D-O]

I'm still MAF

Mass Air Flow sensor? Did not know you could use one with the CSL intake.

A CSL intake has always been part of the plan, but threads like this make me wonder just how big a gamble I am taking. These days we are talking something like $4k for this upgrade. Too much to end up unhappy.

[9kracing]

Check this thread, maybe it will be helpful https://nam3forum.com/forums/forum/s...or-drivability

I'm still MAF

[usdmej]

most shops/tuners will recommend alpha-N simply because it's easier to install and tune. they know that most paying customers aren't interested in spending more time and money than they have to so they can always fall back on the MAP suggestion if a customer is unhappy with the end product.

anyone that puts the effort into making the jump to a MAP sensor setup is generally going to be more nit-picky and have higher expectations for their setup. they want OE driveability and that includes flooring it at 2500 RPM without anything wacky going on. that might explain why you see more complaints about driveability from guys running the complete setup

[BMWfanz]

I don't want to start a big thing, but my car has been tuned 4 times by Hassan, and I haven't been happy with a single one. Granted, my car isn't your average CSL intake car, but I expected more given the nutsack riding that goes on here.

I'm used to tuners spending a few hours on the dyno, and then doing a street tune to really nail down the part throttle. My car bucks hard under toe in, and there's other issues as well. I'm not saying HTE doesn't produce good tunes, but I've always questioned the efficacy of remote tuning.

I bought an AEM standalone I plan to switch to in the future.

Check this thread, maybe it will be helpful https://nam3forum.com/forums/forum/s...or-drivability

[9kracing]

I don't want to start a big thing, but my car has been tuned 4 times by Hassan, and I haven't been happy with a single one. Granted, my car isn't your average CSL intake car, but I expected more given the nutsack riding that goes on here.

I'm used to tuners spending a few hours on the dyno, and then doing a street tune to really nail down the part throttle. My car bucks hard under toe in, and there's other issues as well. I'm not saying HTE doesn't produce good tunes, but I've always questioned the efficacy of remote tuning.

I bought an AEM standalone I plan to switch to in the future.

[Tbonem3]

Modifying an E46 M3 with NA mods and caring about usable torque is laughable.

Also, if you're cruising around at 2500 rpm, uh why?.

Ha, the posts on m3post regarding s65 are even worse.

You have almost 9000 rpm people!

____________

Boo hoo my alpha n tune feels a little weak at light throttle in the trader Joe's parking lot 😭

Alpha N is a non issue on a healthy car (fresh o2s, plugs, coils etc) being driven by someone with a modicum of ability in a manner commensurate with the car's nature i.e. not 5 mile round trip coffee drive thru run.

Also, the # of people reporting issues with their map setup are out numbering alpha n complains now. I don't mean to claim that map is inherently inferior, but it is more complex and costly yet doesn't seem to guarantee a smooth experience any more so than alpha N