CSL airbox vs throttle response/low rpm torque

[Obioban]

Have your tuner get it close (requires a wideband O2 and data logging).

Then, dial it in to be like stock with this: https://nam3forum.com/forums/forum/special-interests/coding-tuning/242281-a-quick-and-easy-way-to-street-tune-your-csl-conversion-for-drivability.

If it feels weird/bad/weak at low RPM, it's an AFR issue.

[Projecte46m3]

I don't want to start a big thing, but my car has been tuned 4 times by Hassan, and I haven't been happy with a single one. Granted, my car isn't your average CSL intake car, but I expected more given the nutsack riding that goes on here.

I'm used to tuners spending a few hours on the dyno, and then doing a street tune to really nail down the part throttle. My car bucks hard under toe in, and there's other issues as well. I'm not saying HTE doesn't produce good tunes, but I've always questioned the efficacy of remote tuning.

I bought an AEM standalone I plan to switch to in the future.

I feel you!

Did you ever get the AEM standalone dialed in? If so, tuner?

[Bry5on]

How do we combine the two? 🤔

The base maps are sufficiently different that you cannot combine the two, sorry!

[EthanolTurbo]

Bryson's Mullet tune drivability is better than HTE -- I had a dyno and road tuned HTE tune that included partial throttle tuning that would still buck and hesitate between 1-3K RPM. Bryson's is much better.

How do we combine the two? 🤔

[Phoenix///M3]

That's correct as it should be based on the non-CSL base maps. The car will not be able to properly adapt to changes in ambient environments (air density, altitude, etc) and you will be forced to run without a flap and you lose the digital oil level measurement, so you'll need to use the dipstick under the manifold or let the non-CSL dipstick slap/vibrate against your chassis or wiring harness.

Never cared for a flap so went Karb race.

So we have a lot of cars on Alpha N between US and UK and likely many use relocated dip stick. Do we have any evidence of broken ones, ever? On my relo I'm no where near the chassis and have few mm clearance to the plastic harness box.

Also, the DME has its own barometric pressure sensor so there is a reference for altitude. There are some interesting deep dive posts on m3cutters debating alpha N vs map. Some arguing the CSL is using alpha N most of the time with pressure correction table lookup from the MAP (so not full speed density) and the DME baro sensor for altitude.

Any case, my only point is HTE has the tune down and for a non HP dme car, the map conversion doesn't seem worth it to me.




Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[Bry5on]

Just throwing in here not seeing most of these issues on HTE Alpha N tune. I do get the occasional, maybe 1 out of 30, dead space on matched rev downshift.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

That’s correct as it should be based on the non-CSL base maps. The car will not be able to properly adapt to changes in ambient environments (air density, altitude, etc) and you will be forced to run without a flap and you lose the digital oil level measurement, so you’ll need to use the dipstick under the manifold or let the non-CSL dipstick slap/vibrate against your chassis or wiring harness.

[Phoenix///M3]

Just throwing in here not seeing most of these issues on HTE Alpha N tune. I do get the occasional, maybe 1 out of 30, dead space on matched rev downshift.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[Rudbari]

Had a csl intake with epic tune alpha-n no issues but then I moved to ess supercharger

[dreamdrivedrift]

Bryson's Mullet tune drivability is better than HTE -- I had a dyno and road tuned HTE tune that included partial throttle tuning that would still buck and hesitate between 1-3K RPM. Bryson's is much better.

[tnord]

good thought, it is original on my car. I've only been using ethanol free fuel for about 10 years now, but it's still probably time.

[usdmej]

^ If your fuel pump is original I'd replace that too

[tnord]

Add me to the list.

Evolve box, MAP conversion with Kassel's solution. I have an early 2003.5, and it appears the DME wasn't switched over yet because I had to have them do the HP conversion. CPI RTX section 1, SS single pipe resonated sect 2, and SS Sport muffler. I've owned the car since 2010, and have replaced coils, plugs, o2 sensors, and rebuilt injectors. I also have the full beisan vanos solution. maybe there's some other component not operating correctly I need to replace but I think I've maintained it fairly well.

Blips around 2500-3000 rpm aren't as responsive as I would hope. Sometimes when slowing at an intersection to make a turn the throttle blips only result in a couple hundred rpm gain rather than the ~1000rpm that I want.

A retune is high on my list of desirables to address this.

[davidinnyc]

FINE! Bry5on, looks like I'm taking a trip up to the Bay.

heinzboehmer might as well do a run through the hills!

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[heinzboehmer]

I just slapped in a Kassel CSL converted DME and MAP sensor with a CSL air rail and I get pretty severe bucking when trying to "floor" it... low end torque also seems to be lacking a bit, but then maybe I was expecting kick you in your pants pulling like everyone says they feel.

David

My (DIY) converted DME works great on my car. But that's only because I'm running Bryson's mullet tune

[CrisSilberGrau]

I just slapped in a Kassel CSL converted DME and MAP sensor with a CSL air rail and I get pretty severe bucking when trying to "floor" it... low end torque also seems to be lacking a bit, but then maybe I was expecting kick you in your pants pulling like everyone says they feel.

David

Schedule a dyno session with HTE to get a custom tune for the car. Bar that you can do some road logging to supplement it.