Aftermarket mufflers - power loss?

[bavarian3]

Soo I'm debating whether to get tips for my stock muffler or save the $ towards an aftermarket muffler. This is less of a thread about sound, but trying to learn if anyone has figures for power gains or loss due to section 3. Tough to trust manufacturer marketing.

Based on my searching here it appears:
-Dinan muffler gains hp (phony and ugly tips tho)
-Rogue el diablo loses hp

I haven't seen any reports about quality offerings such as Supersprint, Eisenmann, etc. Only people fighting about rasp and how the stock muffler is the holy grail.

Insights are appreciated.

[dl.m3]

Basically using the Dinan and the El diablo as examples of what gains and loses power. You can roughly conclude that more uninterrupted flow with less aggressive pipe bends gives you more hp. And anything with kinks (valvetronic lols) and 180deg bends will lose you hp.

[Gearhead55]

This is an oversimplification, but generally more flow will give you more power up top but you will lose low-end and midrange beyond a certain point. Just a general rule of thumb to keep in mind when looking at designs and pipe diameters. With these cars there is not a ton of power to be made by changing the section 3 alone.

[Altaran]

With these cars there is not a ton of power to be made by changing the section 3 alone.

Agreed. If you're trying to prepare with a good section 3 for doing headers & section 1 later on, it may make sense.

OM Scorza is supposed to make power, I'm not sure about the sgt version, but since it's just a carryover it should also have limited power gains. There were some quality concerns back then, but I bought my OM Scorza used on the old forums 11 years ago and it's still running good after countless trackdays.

Every other track M3 here in Germany is running the Supersprint race, so those will also be good for power.

Gesendet von meinem Pixel 7 mit Tapatalk

[Tbonem3]

I'll say this, go look at every time someone uninstalls an aftermarket muffler and goes back to stock. They all say the same thing every time.

[discoelk]

Track cars are also running aftermarket exhausts bc the OEM stuff is heavy not necessarily for power. Just something to keep in mind.

[bavarian3]

Agreed. If you're trying to prepare with a good section 3 for doing headers & section 1 later on, it may make sense.

OM Scorza is supposed to make power, I'm not sure about the sgt version, but since it's just a carryover it should also have limited power gains. There were some quality concerns back then, but I bought my OM Scorza used on the old forums 11 years ago and it's still running good after countless trackdays.

Every other track M3 here in Germany is running the Supersprint race, so those will also be good for power.

To clarify, I already have genuine euro headers and HJS section 1 cats. I'm not looking to make power with a muffler, but rather trying to avoid losing power, and generally just trying to learn if there's data/consensus out there outside the two mentioned. I'm personally changing it for weight loss, nicer tips, more volume(no need to go down this subjective debate).

Funny enough, this setup is already a-hole level loud around city streets if you want it to be(WOT).

[bavarian3]

I'll say this, go look at every time someone uninstalls an aftermarket muffler and goes back to stock. They all say the same thing every time.

Oh yeah, what do they say? It sounded like a honda? lol.

[Halftim3]

I hear most of the aftermarket mufflers drone and the ones that don't drone are:
Dinan
Scorza
Scza
and Supersprint Street.

[Grey Phox]

Ive seen this said before about the El Diablo specifically, but unless you spend all your time in high revs, is this loss even noticeable? That's an honest question. I don't know how you drive your car. If you track it and your looking to squeeze every single HP from it, I would understand that I guess. I've always taken any claim about an intake or exhaust making any noticeable difference in power on cars (its been pretty much all BMW for me since my first car in 2003, an E28) and disregarded it. An Eventuri intake, at least on their site, claims a big increase with the intake on an E46. I honestly think its a bunch of bullshit. But it sounds nice lol. I would love an intake, but to me the Eventuri looks absolutely horrible and Id rather keep it stock unless I was getting a CSL/Karbonius intake.

The way I see it, its now a 20yr old M car. Its quick for what it is, but there's plenty of new Hondas and Volkswagens that will dogwalk me lol so whatever hp I'm loosing there isn't making a difference. Even my E36 was faster than my E46 M3 is now, at one point.

I have an El Diablo with stock section 1 and 2, and while I couldn't tell you if I'm loosing power, it makes me happy whenever I drive it.

[Altaran]

To clarify, I already have genuine euro headers and HJS section 1 cats. I'm not looking to make power with a muffler, but rather trying to avoid losing power, and generally just trying to learn if there's data/consensus out there outside the two mentioned. I'm personally changing it for weight loss, nicer tips, more volume(no need to go down this subjective debate).

Funny enough, this setup is already a-hole level loud around city streets if you want it to be(WOT).

Yeah, HJS do increase noise compared to OE, as they are much less restrictive.

Based on weight and tips you should definitely go SS Race, but if your current setup is already too loud, you will not be happy with the SS Race.

Maybe the SS Sport (middle ground of the three Supersprint options) would hit the sweet spot for you. It's lighter than stock, good quality / nice looking tips, quieter than the race, and will not loose power. A friend of mine had it on his M3 here in Germany and it was not loud at all compared with my Scorza. He actually sold it because it was too quiet for him...

Another option to quiet down the exhaust without loosing power is the SS dual Section 2 resonated. Compared to the OEM Section two, my car lost 4 decibel.

Gesendet von meinem Pixel 7 mit Tapatalk

[bavarian3]

Ive seen this said before about the El Diablo specifically, but unless you spend all your time in high revs, is this loss even noticeable? That's an honest question. I don't know how you drive your car. If you track it and your looking to squeeze every single HP from it, I would understand that I guess. I've always taken any claim about an intake or exhaust making any noticeable difference in power on cars (its been pretty much all BMW for me since my first car in 2003, an E28) and disregarded it. An Eventuri intake, at least on their site, claims a big increase with the intake on an E46. I honestly think its a bunch of bullshit. But it sounds nice lol. I would love an intake, but to me the Eventuri looks absolutely horrible and Id rather keep it stock unless I was getting a CSL/Karbonius intake.

The way I see it, its now a 20yr old M car. Its quick for what it is, but there's plenty of new Hondas and Volkswagens that will dogwalk me lol so whatever hp I'm losing there isn't making a difference. Even my E36 was faster than my E46 M3 is now, at one point.

I have an El Diablo with stock section 1 and 2, and while I couldn't tell you if I'm losing power, it makes me happy whenever I drive it.

The loss is minimal, but all the little things( like weight loss) add up especially when already limited on power.

I hear the el diablo sounds very nice however.

Yeah, HJS do increase noise compared to OE, as they are much less restrictive.

Based on weight and tips you should definitely go SS Race, but if your current setup is already too loud, you will not be happy with the SS Race.

Maybe the SS Sport (middle ground of the three Supersprint options) would hit the sweet spot for you. It's lighter than stock, good quality / nice looking tips, quieter than the race, and will not lose power. A friend of mine had it on his M3 here in Germany and it was not loud at all compared with my Scorza. He actually sold it because it was too quiet for him...

Another option to quiet down the exhaust without losing power is the SS dual Section 2 resonated. Compared to the OEM Section two, my car lost 4 decibel.

Thanks for the info, I figured the cats may have had something to do with increased volume. Not a ton of folks out there with this setup so I was pleasantly surprised. The setup is only loud at WOT however, so no issue putting around town.

The options I'm thinking are:
1. Eisenmann race - great looking tips in 76mm(83mm are giant IMO), mild weight loss, appears to be on the mellow side for a race.
2. Supersprint race - tons of em out there, great tips, notable weight loss,
3. Dinan, but the black tips are a no go and not sure how feasible/cost effective it is to change.
4. Wait for some new product to be produced. I see the Sunbeam thread, also heard of others looking to create new solutions. Doesn't seem like these ever actually arrive though.

[Cubieman]

SGT SCZA is nice as well, I'm sure its got to be pretty damn close to the OM, but unfortunately you would have to deal with Shatus Gruppe and wait a year for an "in stock" muffler.

[Nate047]

If you put in a SuperSprint race section 3 or a Sunbeam straight pipe, your car is going to be dramatically louder, so you’ll think you’re gaining power even if you’re not. But also you’re going to be that guy.

That does actually speak to the greater truth here though, at the end of the day, sound and how you feel while driving is more important psychologically than actual power figures if you’re talking about like +\- single digit hp on a street car. You literally won’t know if you’re going faster or just sounding better.

But you’ll definitely know it if you fuck it up and now your car is way too loud and it annoys you.

[discoelk]

A good thought process might be to assume that a majority of aftermarket mufflers wont improve power(rather than lose power) and consider sound as an enjoyment improvement depending on what you like.

Re: discrete power gain/loss. I know an e46 m3 is not a rocket by modern standards but it's still a very fast road car on modern tires. Some of y'all's speed/power comments make me glad I will rarely share public roads with you if you're really approaching the limits of this platform on the street.