Karbonius

[Mattn1192]

I emailed them

The race box is just has a built in snorkel
Instead of adding one it’s 1 piece

I see ECS has the race box cheaper 🤫

I went with a regular version awaiting the batch from IND

AP Motorsport in the UK has them in stock
I’ve emailed them as well


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This the one you’re referring to?

https://www.apmotorsport.co.uk/product-page/e46-m3-csl-carbon-airbox-karbonius-v2-race

[repoman89]

I'm running an OEM CSL airbox, with the race style dirty side. I've logged AITs-- by ~10mph my intake temps are ~ambient. In all of first gear I'm traction limited either way, so I don't really care if I'm making less power 0-10mph due to high intake temps. Drivability is fine.

Combined, I have zero desire to switch to the flap. Less noise, more weight, more complexity, more failure points (especially as the flap motor seems to be a ~50,000 mile wear item, based on the CSL forums), in exchange for a benefit that I don't feel like can be realized. IMO BMW put it on the CSL for the exact reason they stated them did-- noise control, to allow the car to be legal to sell. I don't want to reduce airbox noise

Yeah, the flap is a pretty significant contributor to the complexity of the project too. I put in all the effort to add it in and now I have it programmed to be always open in sport mode (both modes have throttle pedal remapped to my preference, which is basically linear). There is no drivability difference compared to my comfort mode, which uses stock CSL sport mode flap settings. At least two local shops who see a lot of conversions have been really impressed with how well it drives ... I put it down to the PCS tune and MAP sensor. I always run the car in flap open mode, so it was kind of a waste of effort. I'd do the race style next time and skip modifying the DME and adding the extra wiring.

So the only cold air ducting you run is the kidney grille piece? Nothing from the fake brake duct area?

[Obioban]

Where did you located your AIT on the oem/race snorkel set up? If you record ambient temp above 10mph, there isn’t really much benefit of having the routed air ducts to the intake of snorkel then?

That's why I'm not running the ducts.

It's in the OE location on the clean side of the filter. Not the best picture, but the first one I found in my library where you can see it:

[CheckA]

I'm running an OEM CSL airbox, with the race style dirty side. I've logged AITs-- by ~10mph my intake temps are ~ambient. In all of first gear I'm traction limited either way, so I don't really care if I'm making less power 0-10mph due to high intake temps. Drivability is fine.

Combined, I have zero desire to switch to the flap. Less noise, more weight, more complexity, more failure points (especially as the flap motor seems to be a ~50,000 mile wear item, based on the CSL forums), in exchange for a benefit that I don't feel like can be realized. IMO BMW put it on the CSL for the exact reason they stated them did-- noise control, to allow the car to be legal to sell. I don't want to reduce airbox noise

Where did you located your AIT on the oem/race snorkel set up? If you record ambient temp above 10mph, there isn’t really much benefit of having the routed air ducts to the intake of snorkel then?

[Obioban]

I'm looking at doing this too. Have started to assemble pieces I'll need (MSS54 ECU w/ CSL code, MAP sensor conversion, smaller parts and pieces, etc.) but have a question.

Race:

https://karbonius.net/producto/bmw-m...l-race-airbox/

vs. "normal" CSL box + the carbon flap:

https://karbonius.net/producto/bmw-m...ox-fullcarbon/
https://karbonius.net/producto/bmw-m3-e46-snorkel/

In addition to what's mentioned above, are there any other benefits to one vs. the other?

I'm not planning on running the BMW flap because of the additional complexity.


EDIT: I just read thru Cubieman's linked content. Seems like the Normal CSL + flap would allow you to get cooler air to the intake more easily. Other than that, I was thinking along the lines of driveability between the two at lower RPMs when I asked my question.

I'm running an OEM CSL airbox, with the race style dirty side. I've logged AITs-- by ~10mph my intake temps are ~ambient. In all of first gear I'm traction limited either way, so I don't really care if I'm making less power 0-10mph due to high intake temps. Drivability is fine.

Combined, I have zero desire to switch to the flap. Less noise, more weight, more complexity, more failure points (especially as the flap motor seems to be a ~50,000 mile wear item, based on the CSL forums), in exchange for a benefit that I don't feel like can be realized. IMO BMW put it on the CSL for the exact reason they stated them did-- noise control, to allow the car to be legal to sell. I don't want to reduce airbox noise

[sc_tr0jan_m3]

You’ll want to get a proper tune.

I tried a few tuners before finally going to Randy at Epic Motorsports. He fixed all the issues I had with an alpha n tune. Can’t recommend him enough… he’s been around for years and many of the racers in Nasa/scca run his software.


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[Casa de Mesa]

I'm looking at doing this too. Have started to assemble pieces I'll need (MSS54 ECU w/ CSL code, MAP sensor conversion, smaller parts and pieces, etc.) but have a question.

Race:

https://karbonius.net/producto/bmw-m...l-race-airbox/

vs. "normal" CSL box + the carbon flap:

https://karbonius.net/producto/bmw-m...ox-fullcarbon/
https://karbonius.net/producto/bmw-m3-e46-snorkel/

In addition to what's mentioned above, are there any other benefits to one vs. the other?

I'm not planning on running the BMW flap because of the additional complexity.


EDIT: I just read thru Cubieman's linked content. Seems like the Normal CSL + flap would allow you to get cooler air to the intake more easily. Other than that, I was thinking along the lines of driveability between the two at lower RPMs when I asked my question.

[jet_dogg]

Support the little man, buy direct they're good peeps and accommodating.

[Cubieman]

The only advantage I see from the snorkel is if you are looking to connect the air ducts/hoses to the front bumper air inlet for cold air. Which leads me to the next question about air ducts. How is the unfiltered section of the box connect to the air inlet? I see the box has the opening at the bottom for air duct, but where does that lead to exactly?

The back hole uses a series of peices to pull colder air from down in the black plastic cover panel/brake duct area. There is a 3D computer image of this somewhere on the forums that let's you see what's going on a bit easier.

https://www.realoem.com/bmw/enUS/showparts?id=BL96-EUR---E46-BMW-M3+CSL&diagId=11_3518

I used a section of brake ducting to connect the smaller hole to the brake duct after seeing another member do the same.

https://nam3forum.com/forums/forum/main-forum/e46-2001-2006/42627-csl-airbox-ducting-with-standard-m3-bumper

[Cubieman]

The race version may see cooler intake temps due to the shape especially when NOT using a CSL style front bumper as many won't be using.

I like the look of the OE snorkel/flap and actually found wiring the flap worth my while after low speed drivability was improved a bit and what felt like was maybe even some low end torque gained at low speed as well.

One thing that's nice about the factory snorkel assembly (or Karb equiv.) is you can drill a hole down at the "mouth" of it and mount your IAT there for less heatsoak. The stock CSL IAT location does see quite a bit of heatsoak, after relocating the sensor and using the Eventuri piece that ducts more air into the hole in the brake duct I have seen my IAT temps drop significantly.

[Stack]

I emailed them

The race box is just has a built in snorkel
Instead of adding one it’s 1 piece

I see ECS has the race box cheaper 🤫

I went with a regular version awaiting the batch from IND

AP Motorsport in the UK has them in stock
I’ve emailed them as well


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[CheckA]

The only advantage I see from the snorkel is if you are looking to connect the air ducts/hoses to the front bumper air inlet for cold air. Which leads me to the next question about air ducts. How is the unfiltered section of the box connect to the air inlet? I see the box has the opening at the bottom for air duct, but where does that lead to exactly?

[wahsm]

Does anyone know the performance and sound difference between their regular vs race boxes? Seem like their race box is cheaper since you don’t have to spent extra for snorkel.

I asked them about this two weeks ago as probably going to order one in the next month. They said no difference in sound, which I wouldn't really expect there to be, seems to be the same airbox other than the bolt on part for the snorkel. Going to go with the "racebox" since I see no need for the flap.

[CheckA]

Does anyone know the performance and sound difference between their regular vs race boxes? Seem like their race box is cheaper since you don’t have to spent extra for snorkel.

[M3Giovan]

Thanks for the advise!
Karbonius + snorkel, straight from K!