If you ever had to replace your e46 M3

[lcrain]

Look at an X3M. It has 95% of the performance of the G80 and more practical for carseats/strollers/etc. I'm continually impressed by mine. CT5Vbw are sick though...

I need to drive one of those. A friend of mine has a tennis ball colored one. Space in our garage is at a premium so the smaller the better. Though I imagine an x3m is not too much bigger from a footprint standpoint than the ct5.

[Gearhead55]

A mezger GT3 is truly a special machine. They are track cars, no two ways around that. Problem is that I would probably drive it even less than I drive my e46 m3.

As a father of two children now, I have been thinking about adding something I could put the kids in the backseat of more easily (they are both in giant car seats). Thinking g80 m3 or ct5vbw. Even with one of these cars, I would need to wait until my older child is front facing to really make them work...

Look at an X3M. It has 95% of the performance of the G80 and more practical for carseats/strollers/etc. I'm continually impressed by mine. CT5Vbw are sick though...

[lcrain]

A mezger GT3 is truly a special machine. They are track cars, no two ways around that. Problem is that I would probably drive it even less than I drive my e46 m3.

As a father of two children now, I have been thinking about adding something I could put the kids in the backseat of more easily (they are both in giant car seats). Thinking g80 m3 or ct5vbw. Even with one of these cars, I would need to wait until my older child is front facing to really make them work...

[CrisSilberGrau]

I don't really see the comparison between M3/GT3. One is a road car and one is a track car. Considering the limits of the M3, and how much trouble that car can get you in on the road, I often prefer an even slower car.

I genuinely do see it as a comparison but not stock to stock. The very limited timid driving of a 997.2 RS I've had you can immediately feel the rigidity of the chassis over a stock M3 but not so much over the current state mine is in. You feel the rose jointed bushings and how stable the platform is. Again I did maybe 60km/h driving on normal roads so take that as you will. The Mezger is arguably more special, it has 400 and 600cc more than the S54 in different trims, torque gap is immediately apparent. If I'd be forced to trade my M3 I'd also take a GT3 but I'm a bit particular. A 996.1 body with the .2 engine, semantics aside it would have to be a 996. The other car would be a F355 Challenge.

Properly setup, with appropriate mods that accentuate the chassis (its failings, increase rigidity and remove weight etc) full on NA build (even 3.5L), remove most rubber bushings and replace with motorsport grade hardware, you have something really special. Just not for everyone.

An RS comes like that from factory which arguably makes it cooler. Plans for the CSL for example were much more aggressive, they wanted to give it a full carbon dash but costs were considered unfavorable.

Never would I trade the M3 for a normal 911 S 4S, there the cost to upkeep the 996/7 with the same use case makes the M3 look like a walk in the park.

My 2 cents.

[SQ13]

I'm not suggesting that the m3 is similar at all to any GT product. And I don't really think that's a standard progression either since you have to add a zero to the end of the M3 value to acquire one. What I am suggesting is that the 996/997.1S is not that much better than the M3, and I personally don't think is worth the $25k premium. But I've only driven two examples, neither of which were in tip-top shape.

Wasn't accusing you of anything. I personally thought the M3 was a violent and visceral experience....until I got seat time with the 997 GT3. I think the standard progression from E46 M3 to GT3 was more common 5-10 years ago when the GT3s could be had for under $100k (even the 997 3RS! ). But yeah I don't think I'd replace the M3 with a non-GT3 997. I had a 981 Cayman GTS before I got the GT3 which arguably has the best sounding exhaust note out of all modern non-GT Porsches, and while that car was a blast, I still wouldn't replace the silver M3 with it.

I don't really see the comparison between M3/GT3. One is a road car and one is a track car. Considering the limits of the M3, and how much trouble that car can get you in on the road, I often prefer an even slower car.

I feel like my M3 with nearly 400 bhp can still be enjoyed on backroads without risking jail time and comfortably daily driven, and it's fully set up for the track too. The GT3 on the other hand is just harsh and cannot be used close to its full potential on the street without risking lives and/or risking jail time. Getting up to 155 and having the car beg for more feels really crazy.

Not sure what you think makes the M3 not a track car— it’s great at it.

Even going to PCA track events (Porsche club), generally half the cars there are M3s.

hard to go to any club’s events and not see M3s– unless they’re somehow restricted.

This. The M3 is still such a pleasure to drive on track. And being able to stuff spare wheels and equipment inside the car makes it such a practical double duty car.

The GT3 is more or less the ultimate track car, I just fail to see the M3/GT3 comparison as apples to apples and don't see one as a stepping stone to the other. M3 -> 911, sure, but not M3 -> GT3.

I'd think a Ferrari, Boxster Spyder, Aston, etc makes a better road car and even those are, therefore, more relatable.

Fair point on the road car comparison. I have Merc for DD purposes, so I was just responding to the OP's question with the idea that I'd be replacing my fun/weekend car.

[tnord]

2016 GT350

this is a good answer.

[02_lsb]

2016 GT350

[usdmej]

What I am suggesting is that the 996/997.1S is not that much better than the M3, and I personally don't think is worth the $25k premium. But I've only driven two examples, neither of which were in tip-top shape.

I've driven a low mileage collector grade 996.1 with ROW suspension, if you want to call that a sports car then at best the e46 m3 is just a sporty type of normal car

[Obioban]

The GT3 is more or less the ultimate track car, I just fail to see the M3/GT3 comparison as apples to apples and don't see one as a stepping stone to the other. M3 -> 911, sure, but not M3 -> GT3.

I'd think a Ferrari, Boxster Spyder, Aston, etc makes a better road car and even those are, therefore, more relatable.

While fulling agreeing the GT3 is better on track, I don't necessarily agree it's a better track car. As in...
1) you are forced into one of two choices-- towing, or compromised tires. Towing sucks. M3 fits four 285s in the back seat and still has the truck for tools/spares/tent/etc.
2) Part of tracking a car is being willing/able to write it off, without insurance covering it. That's... a chunk of change for a GT3. Huge part of why a Miata is such a good track car.

[Sharocks]

I test-drove a 2016 Gen 1 BMW M2 "Pure" (a stripped-down, manual-only variant with no-cost options, manual seats, and no sunroof specifically for the Australian market). To save weight and cost, this edition lacks several premium features standard on US models: manual-adjust sports seats, a 7-speaker sound system, standard Bi-Xenon headlights, and no Comfort Access


Overview of the 2016 M2 Pure:

• Seats: Manual-adjust sports seats rather than heated, power-adjustable versions.
• Audio: Basic 7-speaker sound system (replaces the 12-speaker Harman Kardon setup).
• Headlights: Standard Bi-Xenon units instead of Adaptive LED headlights with High Beam Assist.
• Convenience: Lacks Comfort Access (keyless entry), a feature often missed for the price point.
• Security: It drops the upgraded alarm system found on higher trims.

This raw, purist approach makes it a strong contender for my next car.

The 2018 M2 is basically the spiritual successor to the E46 in modern times.

People hate on it for not having the S55, but that's the secret to it being so good.

The S55 sucks and sounds terrible. The bespoke N55 they made for the OG M2's is more M than the S55 entirely.

If I didn't have another M3, I'd have one and I'm still considering adding one.

I've convinced at least 5 ex-E46 M3 owners to jump into 2018 M2s and they all love it.

[01SG]

The GT3 is more or less the ultimate track car, I just fail to see the M3/GT3 comparison as apples to apples and don't see one as a stepping stone to the other. M3 -> 911, sure, but not M3 -> GT3.

I'd think a Ferrari, Boxster Spyder, Aston, etc makes a better road car and even those are, therefore, more relatable.

[oceansize]

Wasn't a 997 GT3 from that era around a $100,000 to $130,000 MSRP and weighed around 3000 pounds? Never driven one, but it better be better in every way imaginable. Light years better.

[01SG]

Not sure what you think makes the M3 not a track car— it’s great at it.

Even going to PCA track events (Porsche club), generally half the cars there are M3s.

hard to go to any club’s events and not see M3– unless they’re somehow restricted.

My words could be more precise, but the GT3 is, of course, a more specialized machine that is far closer to race car and orders of magnitude less street friendly than a standard M3. Even a CSL is supposedly quite a bit more so than the 996 gt3.

There is overlap, but they serve different purposes.

[BL92]

I test-drove a 2016 Gen 1 BMW M2 "Pure" (a stripped-down, manual-only variant with no-cost options, manual seats, and no sunroof specifically for the Australian market). To save weight and cost, this edition lacks several premium features standard on US models: manual-adjust sports seats, a 7-speaker sound system, standard Bi-Xenon headlights, and no Comfort Access


Overview of the 2016 M2 Pure:

• Seats: Manual-adjust sports seats rather than heated, power-adjustable versions.
• Audio: Basic 7-speaker sound system (replaces the 12-speaker Harman Kardon setup).
• Headlights: Standard Bi-Xenon units instead of Adaptive LED headlights with High Beam Assist.
• Convenience: Lacks Comfort Access (keyless entry), a feature often missed for the price point.
• Security: It drops the upgraded alarm system found on higher trims.

This raw, purist approach makes it a strong contender for my next car.

[Obioban]

I don't really see the comparison between M3/GT3. One is a road car and one is a track car. Considering the limits of the M3, and how much trouble that car can get you in on the road, I often prefer an even slower car.

Not sure what you think makes the M3 not a track car— it’s great at it.

Even going to PCA track events (Porsche club), generally half the cars there are M3s.

hard to go to any club’s events and not see M3s– unless they’re somehow restricted.