Need help doing vanos test with INPA

[GNevarc]

Your adjustment range is perfect.
0 to 60 for intake and 0 to 48 for exhaust is the spec.

Your adjustment times are within BMW spec, but a bit slow in my opinion, mine does intake in 200-230ms and exhaust in 180-200ms, so there is some improvement possible there.

Generally we declared under 250ms to be good, iirc.

Hope this helps.

Thank you!


So, do you know what could be causing this slowness?

[bmwfnatic]

My results:


Test file : C:\EDIABAS\ECU\MSS54_VANOS_TESTS.TST
Start : 01.07.2022 22:30:16.1
Nr 1( 1) : 01.07.2022 22:30:16.2
apiJob("mss54ds0","STEUERN_EVANOS1_FRUEHANSCHLAG", "","")
JOB_STATUS = OKAY
EVAN_ISTWERT = 0 00 00 ..
EVAN_SOLLWERT = -10 FF FF FF F6 ÿÿÿö
EVAN_ISTWERT_EINH = Grad KW
EVAN_SOLLWERT_EINH = Grad KW
Nr 2( 1) : 01.07.2022 22:30:21.5
apiJob("mss54ds0","STEUERN_EVANOS1_SPAETANSCHLAG", "","")
JOB_STATUS = OKAY
EVAN_ISTWERT = 60 00 3C .<
EVAN_SOLLWERT = 75 00 4B .K
EVAN_ISTWERT_EINH = Grad KW
EVAN_SOLLWERT_EINH = Grad KW
Nr 3( 1) : 01.07.2022 22:30:26.8
apiJob("mss54ds0","STEUERN_EVANOS1_VERSTELLZEIT"," ","")
JOB_STATUS = OKAY
EVAN_VERSTELLZEIT_FRUEH = 391 01 87 .?
EVAN_VERSTELLZEIT_SPAET = 308 01 34 .4
EVAN_VERSTELLZEIT_FRUEH_EINH = ms
EVAN_VERSTELLZEIT_SPAET_EINH = ms
Nr 4( 1) : 01.07.2022 22:30:33.1
apiJob("mss54ds0","STEUERN_EVANOS1_DICHTHEIT",""," ")
JOB_STATUS = OKAY
EVAN_STATUS = EVANOS-1-Einheit vorzeitig weggedriftet
Nr 5( 1) : 01.07.2022 22:30:47.4
apiJob("mss54ds0","STEUERN_AVANOS1_FRUEHANSCHLAG", "","")
JOB_STATUS = OKAY
AVAN_ISTWERT = 0 00 00 ..
AVAN_SOLLWERT = -10 FF FF FF F6 ÿÿÿö
AVAN_ISTWERT_EINH = Grad KW
AVAN_SOLLWERT_EINH = Grad KW
Nr 6( 1) : 01.07.2022 22:30:52.7
apiJob("mss54ds0","STEUERN_AVANOS1_SPAETANSCHLAG", "","")
JOB_STATUS = OKAY
AVAN_ISTWERT = 49 00 31 .1
AVAN_SOLLWERT = 55 00 37 .7
AVAN_ISTWERT_EINH = Grad KW
AVAN_SOLLWERT_EINH = Grad KW
Nr 7( 1) : 01.07.2022 22:30:58.0
apiJob("mss54ds0","STEUERN_AVANOS1_VERSTELLZEIT"," ","")
JOB_STATUS = OKAY
AVAN_VERSTELLZEIT_FRUEH = 290 01 22 ."
AVAN_VERSTELLZEIT_SPAET = 262 01 06 ..
AVAN_VERSTELLZEIT_FRUEH_EINH = ms
AVAN_VERSTELLZEIT_SPAET_EINH = ms
Nr 8( 1) : 01.07.2022 22:31:04.3
apiJob("mss54ds0","STEUERN_AVANOS1_DICHTHEIT",""," ")
JOB_STATUS = OKAY
AVAN_STATUS = AVANOS-1-Einheit vorzeitig weggedriftet
Stop : 01.07.2022 22:31:19.2
Dauer : 63.1 s

so, my vanos its ok?

Your adjustment range is perfect.
0 to 60 for intake and 0 to 48 for exhaust is the spec.

Your adjustment times are within BMW spec, but a bit slow in my opinion, mine does intake in 200-230ms and exhaust in 180-200ms, so there is some improvement possible there.

Generally we declared under 250ms to be good, iirc.

Hope this helps.

[GNevarc]

Unzip the attachment,
place it in C:\EDIABAS\ECU
start Tool32
Click the 2nd [OPEN] icon
open MSS54_VANOS_Test.tst
Press F8 to run all tests
A result screen similar to the quoted code text below should appear *tested only with bench set up! Not with a running engine

Test file : C:\EDIABAS\ECU\MSS54_VANOS_TESTS.TST
Start : 18.06.2020 19:57:00.5
Nr 1( 1) : 18.06.2020 19:57:00.6
apiJob("mss54ds0","STEUERN_EVANOS1_FRUEHANSCHLAG", "","")
JOB_STATUS = OKAY
EVAN_ISTWERT = 60 00 3C .<
EVAN_SOLLWERT = 52 00 34 .4
EVAN_ISTWERT_EINH = Grad KW
EVAN_SOLLWERT_EINH = Grad KW
Nr 2( 1) : 18.06.2020 19:57:06.0
apiJob("mss54ds0","STEUERN_EVANOS1_SPAETANSCHLAG", "","")
JOB_STATUS = OKAY
EVAN_ISTWERT = 60 00 3C .<
EVAN_SOLLWERT = 52 00 34 .4
EVAN_ISTWERT_EINH = Grad KW
EVAN_SOLLWERT_EINH = Grad KW
Nr 3( 1) : 18.06.2020 19:57:11.3
apiJob("mss54ds0","STEUERN_EVANOS1_VERSTELLZEIT"," ","")
JOB_STATUS = OKAY
EVAN_VERSTELLZEIT_FRUEH = 0 00 00 ..
EVAN_VERSTELLZEIT_SPAET = 0 00 00 ..
EVAN_VERSTELLZEIT_FRUEH_EINH = ms
EVAN_VERSTELLZEIT_SPAET_EINH = ms
Nr 4( 1) : 18.06.2020 19:57:17.5
apiJob("mss54ds0","STEUERN_EVANOS1_DICHTHEIT",""," ")
JOB_STATUS = OKAY
EVAN_STATUS = EVANOS-1-Einheit vorzeitig weggedriftet
Nr 5( 1) : 18.06.2020 19:57:32.0
apiJob("mss54ds0","STEUERN_AVANOS1_FRUEHANSCHLAG", "","")
JOB_STATUS = OKAY
AVAN_ISTWERT = 0 00 00 ..
AVAN_SOLLWERT = 0 00 00 ..
AVAN_ISTWERT_EINH = Grad KW
AVAN_SOLLWERT_EINH = Grad KW
Nr 6( 1) : 18.06.2020 19:57:37.3
apiJob("mss54ds0","STEUERN_AVANOS1_SPAETANSCHLAG", "","")
JOB_STATUS = OKAY
AVAN_ISTWERT = 0 00 00 ..
AVAN_SOLLWERT = 0 00 00 ..
AVAN_ISTWERT_EINH = Grad KW
AVAN_SOLLWERT_EINH = Grad KW
Nr 7( 1) : 18.06.2020 19:57:42.5
apiJob("mss54ds0","STEUERN_AVANOS1_VERSTELLZEIT"," ","")
JOB_STATUS = OKAY
AVAN_VERSTELLZEIT_FRUEH = 0 00 00 ..
AVAN_VERSTELLZEIT_SPAET = 0 00 00 ..
AVAN_VERSTELLZEIT_FRUEH_EINH = ms
AVAN_VERSTELLZEIT_SPAET_EINH = ms
Nr 8( 1) : 18.06.2020 19:57:48.9
apiJob("mss54ds0","STEUERN_AVANOS1_DICHTHEIT",""," ")
JOB_STATUS = OKAY
AVAN_STATUS = AVANOS-1-Einheit vorzeitig weggedriftet
Stop : 18.06.2020 19:58:03.3
Dauer : 62.9 s

My results:


Test file : C:\EDIABAS\ECU\MSS54_VANOS_TESTS.TST
Start : 01.07.2022 22:30:16.1
Nr 1( 1) : 01.07.2022 22:30:16.2
apiJob("mss54ds0","STEUERN_EVANOS1_FRUEHANSCHLAG", "","")
JOB_STATUS = OKAY
EVAN_ISTWERT = 0 00 00 ..
EVAN_SOLLWERT = -10 FF FF FF F6 ÿÿÿö
EVAN_ISTWERT_EINH = Grad KW
EVAN_SOLLWERT_EINH = Grad KW
Nr 2( 1) : 01.07.2022 22:30:21.5
apiJob("mss54ds0","STEUERN_EVANOS1_SPAETANSCHLAG", "","")
JOB_STATUS = OKAY
EVAN_ISTWERT = 60 00 3C .<
EVAN_SOLLWERT = 75 00 4B .K
EVAN_ISTWERT_EINH = Grad KW
EVAN_SOLLWERT_EINH = Grad KW
Nr 3( 1) : 01.07.2022 22:30:26.8
apiJob("mss54ds0","STEUERN_EVANOS1_VERSTELLZEIT"," ","")
JOB_STATUS = OKAY
EVAN_VERSTELLZEIT_FRUEH = 391 01 87 .?
EVAN_VERSTELLZEIT_SPAET = 308 01 34 .4
EVAN_VERSTELLZEIT_FRUEH_EINH = ms
EVAN_VERSTELLZEIT_SPAET_EINH = ms
Nr 4( 1) : 01.07.2022 22:30:33.1
apiJob("mss54ds0","STEUERN_EVANOS1_DICHTHEIT",""," ")
JOB_STATUS = OKAY
EVAN_STATUS = EVANOS-1-Einheit vorzeitig weggedriftet
Nr 5( 1) : 01.07.2022 22:30:47.4
apiJob("mss54ds0","STEUERN_AVANOS1_FRUEHANSCHLAG", "","")
JOB_STATUS = OKAY
AVAN_ISTWERT = 0 00 00 ..
AVAN_SOLLWERT = -10 FF FF FF F6 ÿÿÿö
AVAN_ISTWERT_EINH = Grad KW
AVAN_SOLLWERT_EINH = Grad KW
Nr 6( 1) : 01.07.2022 22:30:52.7
apiJob("mss54ds0","STEUERN_AVANOS1_SPAETANSCHLAG", "","")
JOB_STATUS = OKAY
AVAN_ISTWERT = 49 00 31 .1
AVAN_SOLLWERT = 55 00 37 .7
AVAN_ISTWERT_EINH = Grad KW
AVAN_SOLLWERT_EINH = Grad KW
Nr 7( 1) : 01.07.2022 22:30:58.0
apiJob("mss54ds0","STEUERN_AVANOS1_VERSTELLZEIT"," ","")
JOB_STATUS = OKAY
AVAN_VERSTELLZEIT_FRUEH = 290 01 22 ."
AVAN_VERSTELLZEIT_SPAET = 262 01 06 ..
AVAN_VERSTELLZEIT_FRUEH_EINH = ms
AVAN_VERSTELLZEIT_SPAET_EINH = ms
Nr 8( 1) : 01.07.2022 22:31:04.3
apiJob("mss54ds0","STEUERN_AVANOS1_DICHTHEIT",""," ")
JOB_STATUS = OKAY
AVAN_STATUS = AVANOS-1-Einheit vorzeitig weggedriftet
Stop : 01.07.2022 22:31:19.2
Dauer : 63.1 s

so, my vanos its ok?

[Tomba]

For the 'drift' test, what is the expected result? I do not see any test results showing other than "AVANOS-1-Einheit vorzeitig weggedriftet".

No or small drift. My suspicion is,
- camshaft is set at a position
- none of the electric valves are activated for xx seconds
- after xx seconds the position at the beginning and end is checked against each other
- If too large difference is observed you will see an error

But I am not 100% sure.

[JBAshland]

Hi - Thank you Tomba for putting this together. I recently rebuilt my Vanos with Beisan seals, etc. and wanted to test it out. Not having access to Autologic, this was great. Question: For the 'drift' test, what is the expected result? I do not see any test results showing other than "AVANOS-1-Einheit vorzeitig weggedriftet".

Below are my results: 61 for intake and 47 for exhaust. I also noticed that if ran the test a few more times, the activation speeds seem to improve, but these are the initial results.

Results
Testdatei : C:\EDIABAS\ECU\MSS54_VANOS_TESTS\MSS54_VANOS_TESTS .TST
Start : 03.04.2022 08:32:31.2
Nr 1( 1) : 03.04.2022 08:32:31.3
apiJob("mss54ds0","STEUERN_EVANOS1_FRUEHANSCHLAG", "","")
JOB_STATUS = OKAY
EVAN_ISTWERT = 0 00 00 ..
EVAN_SOLLWERT = -10 FF FF FF F6 ÿÿÿö
EVAN_ISTWERT_EINH = Grad KW
EVAN_SOLLWERT_EINH = Grad KW
Nr 2( 1) : 03.04.2022 08:32:36.8
apiJob("mss54ds0","STEUERN_EVANOS1_SPAETANSCHLAG", "","")
JOB_STATUS = OKAY
EVAN_ISTWERT = 61 00 3D .=
EVAN_SOLLWERT = 75 00 4B .K
EVAN_ISTWERT_EINH = Grad KW
EVAN_SOLLWERT_EINH = Grad KW
Nr 3( 1) : 03.04.2022 08:32:42.1
apiJob("mss54ds0","STEUERN_EVANOS1_VERSTELLZEIT"," ","")
JOB_STATUS = OKAY
EVAN_VERSTELLZEIT_FRUEH = 300 01 2C .,
EVAN_VERSTELLZEIT_SPAET = 281 01 19 ..
EVAN_VERSTELLZEIT_FRUEH_EINH = ms
EVAN_VERSTELLZEIT_SPAET_EINH = ms
Nr 4( 1) : 03.04.2022 08:32:48.5
apiJob("mss54ds0","STEUERN_EVANOS1_DICHTHEIT",""," ")
JOB_STATUS = OKAY
EVAN_STATUS = EVANOS-1-Einheit vorzeitig weggedriftet
Nr 5( 1) : 03.04.2022 08:33:03.0
apiJob("mss54ds0","STEUERN_AVANOS1_FRUEHANSCHLAG", "","")
JOB_STATUS = OKAY
AVAN_ISTWERT = 0 00 00 ..
AVAN_SOLLWERT = -10 FF FF FF F6 ÿÿÿö
AVAN_ISTWERT_EINH = Grad KW
AVAN_SOLLWERT_EINH = Grad KW
Nr 6( 1) : 03.04.2022 08:33:08.4
apiJob("mss54ds0","STEUERN_AVANOS1_SPAETANSCHLAG", "","")
JOB_STATUS = OKAY
AVAN_ISTWERT = 47 00 2F ./
AVAN_SOLLWERT = 55 00 37 .7
AVAN_ISTWERT_EINH = Grad KW
AVAN_SOLLWERT_EINH = Grad KW
Nr 7( 1) : 03.04.2022 08:33:13.8
apiJob("mss54ds0","STEUERN_AVANOS1_VERSTELLZEIT"," ","")
JOB_STATUS = OKAY
AVAN_VERSTELLZEIT_FRUEH = 206 00 CE .Î
AVAN_VERSTELLZEIT_SPAET = 231 00 E7 .ç
AVAN_VERSTELLZEIT_FRUEH_EINH = ms
AVAN_VERSTELLZEIT_SPAET_EINH = ms
Nr 8( 1) : 03.04.2022 08:33:20.2
apiJob("mss54ds0","STEUERN_AVANOS1_DICHTHEIT",""," ")
JOB_STATUS = OKAY
AVAN_STATUS = AVANOS-1-Einheit vorzeitig weggedriftet
Stop : 03.04.2022 08:33:35.3
Dauer : 64.1 s

[Tomba]

The "dichtheid" / leak test performs OK on these and comes with more data. Still similar jobs being performed

[nextelbuddy]

No problem, glad I could help out.




Seems OK to me. All jobs were performed that are listed. 1. retard endstop 2. Advance endstop 3. Activation speeds & 4. leakage test for both sides (8 in total)




Intake is perfect, the position were 0-60°CR (0-60°CR necessary)
Exhasut same, 0-48°CR (0-45°CR necessary)
Intake speed very good 195-205ms (BMW says that anything below 500ms is good, I would rather take 250ms)
Exhasut speed 152-193ms. Exhaust has less degrees to travel (45 vs 60 on intake) I suspect its fast due to this. Numbers looking perfect.
Both intake and exhaust position are drifted. I am not sure how I would need to understand this. I wouldn't worry about it.
So no issues and good results.

thanks so much man.

just curious why my log appears to be smaller or missing information compared to this other persons in this post

https://nam3forum.com/forums/forum/special-interests/coding-tuning/34304-need-help-doing-vanos-test-with-inpa?p=38153#post38153

they seem to have more data? did they run the test differently or did i miss any of the logs somewhere?

[Tomba]

Thank you so much for the 1 click test solution using Tool32. Was very excited to be able to run a vanos test on my system as a base line before i do a vanos refresh.

No problem, glad I could help out.

One thing i'm confused on is why my log file appears to be shorter than some others that have multiple pages. i did a select all or ctrl A in the log area and grabbed the text but my log file i saved in TXT format doesnt have any other sections after:

apiJob("mss54ds0","STEUERN_AVANOS1_DICHTHEIT",""," ")

Seems OK to me. All jobs were performed that are listed. 1. retard endstop 2. Advance endstop 3. Activation speeds & 4. leakage test for both sides (8 in total)

can someone look at mine and let me know if the values are in spec? Or will i need to rerun the test to get more of the log file that i might be missing?

Intake is perfect, the position were 0-60°CR (0-60°CR necessary)
Exhasut same, 0-48°CR (0-45°CR necessary)
Intake speed very good 195-205ms (BMW says that anything below 500ms is good, I would rather take 250ms)
Exhasut speed 152-193ms. Exhaust has less degrees to travel (45 vs 60 on intake) I suspect its fast due to this. Numbers looking perfect.
Both intake and exhaust position are drifted. I am not sure how I would need to understand this. I wouldn't worry about it.
So no issues and good results.

[nextelbuddy]

Thank you so much for the 1 click test solution using Tool32. Was very excited to be able to run a vanos test on my system as a base line before i do a vanos refresh. One thing i'm confused on is why my log file appears to be shorter than some others that have multiple pages. i did a select all or ctrl A in the log area and grabbed the text but my log file i saved in TXT format doesnt have any other sections after:

apiJob("mss54ds0","STEUERN_AVANOS1_DICHTHEIT",""," ")

can someone look at mine and let me know if the values are in spec? Or will i need to rerun the test to get more of the log file that i might be missing?

[sapote]

I think you are just jumping to answer, read what I said. anti-clockwise motion is capped by the caps (pun intended), clockwise motion is limited by the slots in the sprockets. that's it. the cams will get anywhere between those hard points.

Sorry, but we're talking the timing value during engine running and not during a vanos timing set. The slots in the sprocket are only involved during timing setting and they are useless during dynamic timing change with engine running. As soon as the hub bolted were torqued down, the slots are out of the operation so why they are in the discussion of the advanced angles?

[maupineda]

Max retarded position is limited by the vanos front covers, and the max advanced position (piston moved rearward) has more margin beyond the operating advanced timing and so this end should have no problem of achieving desired angle = actual angle.

59 is the Intake actual retarded (limited by vanos cover) and not when the spline bottomed out on the cam sleeve or the cam shaft.

I think you are just jumping to answer, read what I said. anti-clockwise motion is capped by the caps (pun intended), clockwise motion is limited by the slots in the sprockets. that's it. the cams will get anywhere between those hard points.

[sapote]

though there is not a wall on the inward motion of the spline, there is a hard stop, and that is the slot on the cam sprockets, that is the physical limit, and if the timing was off a bit 59 was as much as it could get.

Max retarded position is limited by the vanos front covers, and the max advanced position (piston moved rearward) has more margin beyond the operating advanced timing and so this end should have no problem of achieving desired angle = actual angle.

59 is the Intake actual retarded (limited by vanos cover) and not when the spline bottomed out on the cam sleeve or the cam shaft.

[maupineda]

Btw, I expect to see the actual value has more error at the retarded end and not the advanced end. Why? The retarded end is limited by the piston cover -- a hard wall -- while the advanced end has no hard wall, so why the DME did not nudge the piston to get to 60 (or 48) instead of stopping at 59? Maybe 59 is good enough (within the acceptable range) and DME software doesn't need to waste more time and energy to get it perfect. But so far I haven't seen an error at the retarded end (value 0) from a few test reports.

I also don't know why the desired value is -10 to get actual 0, or 55 instead of 48, or 75 instead of 60. This is a closed-loop control system (using cam sensors as feedback data), so why the it needs to command an overshoot desired target?

though there is not a wall on the inward motion of the spline, there is a hard stop, and that is the slot on the cam sprockets, that is the physical limit, and if the timing was off a bit 59 was as much as it could get.

about your question on the logic, is a very good one for the engineer who made the logic, though it makes perfect sense to me. Go past the limit and see where it gets to, it just works and takes no more/less time to the DME. Besides you will ser how off you are.

[sapote]

I read through the thread again and I think if I understand things correctly the desired readings are:

Inlet: 60 degrees.
Exhaust: 45 degrees

And the test requests a value much higher to see if it will go out of alignment? So in my case on the inlet side the test asked for 75 degrees but it only reached 59. Only 1 degree off from spec so it is ok. On the exhaust side it asked for 55 degrees and it reached 48. This is 3 degrees off from spec. Do you think that is still ok or something to investigate further?
Thanks!

In this test, the perfect "score" for Intake should be 0 (advanced) and 60 (retarded) , and Exhaust should be 0 (advanced) and 48 (retarded) , not 45.
For whatever the reason, the test wanted to move the EX cam through 48 deg and not 45 as in the "General VANOS" document.

As you can tell for a few test results posted by other people, that the command (desired) value is 55 and the actual value is 48 (reading from cam sensor and crank sensor).

Btw, I expect to see the actual value has more error at the retarded end and not the advanced end. Why? The retarded end is limited by the piston cover -- a hard wall -- while the advanced end has no hard wall, so why the DME did not nudge the piston to get to 60 (or 48) instead of stopping at 59? Maybe 59 is good enough (within the acceptable range) and DME software doesn't need to waste more time and energy to get it perfect. But so far I haven't seen an error at the retarded end (value 0) from a few test reports.

I also don't know why the desired value is -10 to get actual 0, or 55 instead of 48, or 75 instead of 60. This is a closed-loop control system (using cam sensors as feedback data), so why the it needs to command an overshoot desired target?

[tupawk]

Looks perfect. It sets a higher / lowered desired setpoint to make sure it’s hitting the end stops. It is possible that it runs a bit over the spec, 0-45 -> 0-48 in yours.
59 degrees is fine.

Tomba thanks again for an awesome thread and help!