Trying to decide: e46 M3 vs F82 M4 vs 997.2

[Aeko]

Sounds like the is500 is your car

Any substantial difference other than number of doors between something like RC F and IS500? I'm leaning towards the coupe is why I ask

[EthanolTurbo]

Any substantial difference other than number of doors between something like RC F and IS500? I'm leaning towards the coupe is why I ask

RCF has better performance because it's an F car, IS500 is kind of the watered down version. Definitely would take an ISF or RCF over the IS500, would take the GSF over all because it has the best chassis and performance.

[Boost]

Haven't had any seat time in an RC-F but have heard from people with our kind of background that the RC chassis is bloated/boaty/dull; perhaps the F trim addresses or masks some of that feedback. On the other hand, have seen some non-F IS chassis (plural) do some impressive canyon carving. But between some of the talk of Porsches/E36s and V8 sedans, we are still a little all over the place here, lol. I've skipped a few pages of this thread; whats your current list of possible selections looking like right now?

[Boost]

I think every enthusiast car of the past decade has been brought up here. I think parameters need to be refined: rwd or awd, turbo or Na, autocross capable or comfortable..

Alright I caught up w/ the thread and agree with the sentiment here. We've eliminated a lot of cars. Make a list of whatever candidates/criteria remain and continue picking it apart from there.

[Boost]

t44tq,

All that being said maybe I should try some of the lighter offerings like a 1M just to try it. Has anyone DCT swapped a 1M? A quick Google search turns up nothing. Maybe a 135i?

Interesting that the 1 series has only come up once in this thread. If you fancy the styling, the 2011+ 135s do come in DCT. Had a client who absolutely loved the combo of coupe/dct/n55 from the factory. You also have the 135is variants to look at.

I'm gonna go out on a limb and say this is the car you'll end up buying.

[EthanolTurbo]

Haven't had any seat time in an RC-F but have heard from people with our kind of background that the RC chassis is bloated/boaty/dull; perhaps the F trim addresses or masks some of that feedback. On the other hand, have seen some non-F IS chassis (plural) do some impressive canyon carving. But between some of the talk of Porsches/E36s and V8 sedans, we are still a little all over the place here, lol. I've skipped a few pages of this thread; whats your current list of possible selections looking like right now?

Here is my friend's bone stock RCF with just springs, wheels and tires running faster times than most dedicated track cars at Buttonwillow.

https://youtu.be/tBqY9monm8o

[Aeko]

Haven't had any seat time in an RC-F but have heard from people with our kind of background that the RC chassis is bloated/boaty/dull; perhaps the F trim addresses or masks some of that feedback. On the other hand, have seen some non-F IS chassis (plural) do some impressive canyon carving. But between some of the talk of Porsches/E36s and V8 sedans, we are still a little all over the place here, lol. I've skipped a few pages of this thread; whats your current list of possible selections looking like right now?

That's kind of the feeling I got from the RC350 F-sport was that it seemed extremely insulated compared to, say, an e39 M5. Not much communication from the tires and suspension, even though it did feel very confident. I have the same question about moving up to the RC F.

Yeah, it's kind of a mess of different cars, lol. Current list of "to drive" cars, vaguely in order of ones that seem most appealing at the top:

E9x M3
RC F
Cayman (987 if I can find one, possibly 981)
Mach 1
GR86
Supra (sat in one, need to drive it)
135 / 1M?
997.2 (if price drops. Drove 997.1 Auto)
E36 Euro spec (ZF8 swap?)
Z4M coupe?

I'm in an apartment so right now having 2 cars is pushing it. I have my daily (replacing with a hatch soon) and I'm looking to replace the e39 M5 with something easier for me to drive now that the M3 is donezo. In the back of my mind I will always be looking for the "perfect" spec e46 M3 (SMG, Estoril / Topaz / LSB?, something like Ecru interior if they even exist) so I may yet wind up back in one of those as well. Right now I just want a break from the e46.

The ZF8 is a pretty hot swap over a DCT these days it seems, and it doesn't seem super astronomical at least parts wise to swap it if I decide I am truly in love with one of the 3 pedal BMWs before committing to that.

I've also considered a 996 S or Turbo, but I really can't get over the interior styling specifically. Have looked at Q50 / Q60 redsports but I don't feel the value is there compared to something like an RC F. Really old platform and the tech like the center nav and radio is aging poorly.

Here is my friend's bone stock RCF with just springs, wheels and tires running faster times than most dedicated track cars at Buttonwillow.

https://youtu.be/tBqY9monm8o

Damn that's impressive

[JaredU]

RCF has better performance because it's an F car, IS500 is kind of the watered down version. Definitely would take an ISF or RCF over the IS500, would take the GSF over all because it has the best chassis and performance.

I haven’t tried the new is500, but I’m sure I would take it over RC-F. I wasn’t a big fan of the RC-F, but it had the power the 350’s are missing, so a nice comfy reliable v8 sedan would be right up my alley.

Concur about the GS-F though. Would absolutely take one over is500. Prices in Canada for GS-F are comical though so had kind of forgot about it.

[EthanolTurbo]

I haven’t tried the new is500, but I’m sure I would take it over RC-F. I wasn’t a big fan of the RC-F, but it had the power the 350’s are missing, so a nice comfy reliable v8 sedan would be right up my alley.

Concur about the GS-F though. Would absolutely take one over is500. Prices in Canada for GS-F are comical though so had kind of forgot about it.

Yeah the GS-F is the one to get, at least for me. It's kind of Lexus' take on a modern E39 M5, with a very similar motor in terms of powerband, displacement and redline. Rare and understated too.

[Aeko]

Yeah the GS-F is the one to get, at least for me. It's kind of Lexus' take on a modern E39 M5, with a very similar motor in terms of powerband, displacement and redline. Rare and understated too.

The e39 is a bit boaty in size for me, so the GS platform seems just too large. The RC felt like it was probably the biggest size of car I'd enjoy driving even though it is about the same size of the e39. If I find a car I really love everything but the size of, I could probably forgive the hugeness as long as it's not bigger than the e39. The e39 is already a tight squeeze in my garage.

Updated my previous list because I forgot about the GR86

[Boost]

..have heard from people with our kind of background that the RC chassis is bloated/boaty/dull; perhaps the F trim addresses or masks some of that feedback

Here is my friend's bone stock RCF with just springs, wheels and tires running faster times than most dedicated track cars at Buttonwillow.

https://youtu.be/tBqY9monm8o

Didn't say it was a slow car.

[Boost]

For shits and giggles,

Car & Driver gave the RC-F a 6.5 out of 10

Edmunds gave the RC-F a 6.9 out of 10

CarWow gave the RC-F a 7.0 out of 10

CNet gave the RC-F a 6.8 out of 10

----

In regard to the RC platform as a whole,

Car & Driver gave it a 5.5 out of 10

US News gave it a 7.4 out of 10

TopGear gave it a 5.0 out of 10

The Car Connection gave it a 6.0 out of 10

----

Is any of this to say that..

1. the RC-F is slow?
2. the RC-F is an objectively bad car?
3. the RC-F is not well-received by its owners & consumers?
4. our purchase decisions should be based solely on reviews from so-called online experts?

Of course not.

But is it to say that the RC-F is an imperfect car whose potential drawbacks or shortcomings might be of particular interest or significance to an M3F member looking to replace their E46 M3?

Yes.

[Boost]

E9x M3
RC F
Cayman (987 if I can find one, possibly 981)
Mach 1
GR86
Supra (sat in one, need to drive it)
135 / 1M?
997.2 (if price drops. Drove 997.1 Auto)
E36 Euro spec (ZF8 swap?)
Z4M coupe?

E9x M3 - Safest, most logical step up from an E46 M3, imo. Stiff chassis, good handling dynamics. Only ~3 inches longer and ~200-300lb heaver than an E46 M3. ~8 inches shorter and ~300lb lighter than an E39 M5.

RC F - No input

Cayman (987 if I can find one, possibly 981) - No input/would not settle for less than a 911

Mach 1 - Interesting.. Budget?

GR86 - Arguably least prestigious car on list, but might check your boxes at a lower price

Supra - Might climb to the top of your list after you drive one; budget?

135i / 1M - Factory DCT + E46 M3-esque power to weight ratio / Budget?

997.2 - Budget?

E36 Euro - Needs to be built

Z4M - S54 again and you dont like cramped cars. Would eliminate

[t44tq]

If you're getting a 997.2, which, IMHO, is a pretty good choice, there's a big difference between the 3.6L base car and the 3.8L S. The base Carrera feels like it needs another 100 hp to be entertaining. It's a very nice place to be, and the PDK is a wonderful transmission. Note that the early PDK cars might have the buttons on the wheel, but that is fixable with a paddle conversion- at least Suncoast used to sell this- not sure if they still have the parts.

The S feels properly fast, although by today's standards, it's not. But it's a nice driving car, with good steering feel, great suspension setup, easy to drive hard, has decent midrange torque. It's not a really heavy pig and it's not too big, like the 991s.

E9x M3 with DCT might be a good choice- they're comfy, handle fine, very heavy but manageable within it's limits (high consumable cost).

Not too many cars that have a good auto/paddle shift and are good sports cars. Mustang GT/Mach 1/Bullitt with the 10 speed auto would be a good alternative if you don't mind a Mustang.

[t44tq]

Cayman (987 if I can find one, possibly 981) - No input/would not settle for less than a 911

if OP doesn't like two seaters, this is not going to be a good choice

Supra - Might climb to the top of your list after you drive one; budget?

again, a two seater

135i / 1M - Factory DCT + E46 M3-esque power to weight ratio / Budget?

Just FYI to OP- 1M only came in manual

Z4M - S54 again and you dont like cramped cars. Would eliminate

The Z4M coupe is definitely claustrophobic- very high sills, poor visibility and a two seater