Ownership Experience of Old BMWs

[Obioban]

It's odd to say the e46 m3 doesn't feel old but the e36 m3 does given that the e46 is merely an evolution and has all the same bones: suspension, chassis, and layout. Sure, the e36 has the old feeling interior and is slower, but driving it is still brilliant. It isn't slow around the turns.

I see this on the e36 forum where they all trash the e46. This marque on marque hate has got to stop! Both are great.

Both are great, and I've had 3 of each.... but the e36 does feel MUCH older than the e46, despite being mechanically similar. That's part of the magic of the e46 IMO-- drives like an old car (good) while not feeling like an old car.

[bigjae46]

Both are great, and I've had 3 of each.... but the e36 does feel MUCH older than the e46, despite being mechanically similar. That's part of the magic of the e46 IMO-- drives like an old car (good) while not feeling like an old car.

I get a little claustrophobic with 2 adults in an E36. I don't know if old is the right adjective but it is much smaller. The E36 controls and interior feel are pedestrian. I think the E46 interior was miles ahead of every other entry level euro sedan on the market at the time.

[TexaZ3]

I own several older BMWs, in fact - E46M is one of my youngest cars. E39 M5 is a great car, parts were really easily available and CHEAP, until maybe 2 years ago? When E39 was moved to Classic parts catalogue, that's when availability just dwindled, and prices skyrocketed. I think that happened to a lot of BMW platforms during Covid shutdowns. They just stopped making those for good when they restarted production. Overall, E39 is still relatively affordable, somewhat similar to E46M.

I also have E34 M5, and parts for that puppy are a LOT harder to come by. Suspension parts are non-existent, lots of original parts are NLA, especially engine/gearbox parts. And don't even get me started on interior or any of the cosmetic stuff - gone, none available. And since these are sooo rare, finding anything second-hand is also a chore, especially in good condition.

But the hardest older BMW to own for me is E31. I have later (M73-engined) 850Ci, so thankfully a lot of engine parts are still available, since the car shared the engine with E38 7er. But for the rest of the car....E31 is such a bespoke design, almost no parts are shared with any other BMW, and as a result - VERY few things are available now, and what's available is VERY expensive. Interior-wise - if you have something broken - it will likely remain broken, since no parts are available for ANY of it, especially if you have a special color or an uncommon spec, like a CSi. Its a freaking disaster. Some aftermarket is starting to appear, but drop in the bucket. Not surprising, with so few cars made.

E36 platform is still somewhat ok (I have M3 and a Z3M), but I think only because there were SOO many of them made, and a lot of parts, especially on US cars were shared with common 3-series. M-specific parts are getting expensive, but at least most are still available.

Its an interesting journey, if you ever decide to embark on it. I have to admit, sometimes it gets hard and frustrating, but its also rewarding. The driving experience is like nothing else - you simply can't get that from any modern car. And if you don't have the need to make these cars absolutely perfect, the ownership is actually not that bad. Get the best car you can find, and enjoy. The experience is worth it - when else are you gonna do it?

[oceansize]

And if you don't have the need to make these cars absolutely perfect, the ownership is actually not that bad. Get the best car you can find, and enjoy.

A couple of years ago I ran into this really young kid at a rural gas station with an Imola red clapped out M3. Didn't give a damn, he was having the best time driving his shite car. It was a turning point for me personally. Quit trying to make it perfect. Get it up to par and make it safe, move on and have fun.

[TexaZ3]

A couple of years ago I ran into this really young kid at a rural gas station with an Imola red clapped out M3. Didn't give a damn, he was having the best time driving his shite car. It was a turning point for me personally. Quit trying to make it perfect. Get it up to par and make it safe, move on and have fun.

Yup, that's the recipe. I remember reading Rob Siegel's Hack Mechanic book some time ago, and this thought stuck with me:

"Anyone can spend big money buying a pretty shiny car, or restoring one. There’s no challenge in that, and it’s not interesting to me. Now, the person who has always wanted a 2002 (or any car), and buys one he can afford, and loves it to death and keeps it going on a shoestring budget...that’s interesting to me.That’s a person who deserves my help.

If I’m about any one thing, car-wise, it’s about trying to be the guy with the shit-eating grin on his face driving the car he’s always wanted. If that means buying an imperfect car, geez Louise it’s better than craving the perfect car and not getting it, or anything, because you can’t afford the level of perfection that you crave. I try to proselytize for this, to actively convince people to buy flawed cars within their budget rather than walk all the way up that ladder and buy nothing."

[Big Nodge]

Across my Lemons/Champ Car crew we own a couple of E30 racecars, and I also have an E36 M3 and the E46 M3. Call me crazy, but I swear I run into the most NLA stuff on the E46 platform of the three. That may be because the E46 is the most anal project. With the E30s we are often just trying to get them back on the track under various hectic circumstances, which is par for the course for amateur endurance racers. It's actually amazing how many parts you can find same-day at O'Reillys and such if all you care about is getting it running. I would never even consider that on the E46, for better or worse.

I also agree that's is pretty amazing how much more modern the E46 feels than the E36. I just got the E36 back on the road so I've been driving it to work, and it feels super tiny when I pull into the parking garage. It's been the first car that I've fully restored myself though, and it does create a special bond. Sort of like my fat tire mountain bike I built from the frame up. It's just always the one I want to ride.

[tnord]

Seems like "restoring" old cars is getting harder and harder, and the older car you get the more important it is to buy the best example. That's probably obvious, but I do sometimes get pulled into the idea of building/saving/restoring something, as I get a good amount of satisfaction out of making things better.

As much as I'd really like to replace my daily F30 with an E39, there's the practical accountant side of my brain that tells me I don't have time to deal with that ownership right now. The F30 is fast, reliable, and efficient. It's also what pulls me to newer cars like a G20 M340 or G30 M550.

But the F30 is also kinda sterile in the way it drives, and the other side of my brain wants the noises and panache of a well cared for E39 540. I don't know if I need to go to a square setup like I had in my E90, or if it's the x drive, or the electric steering. It's great in a high speed steady state, but unless I'm giving it a full boot it just doesn't rotate, nor does the front end seem to bite all that well.

[Obioban]

Seems like "restoring" old cars is getting harder and harder, and the older car you get the more important it is to buy the best example. That's probably obvious, but I do sometimes get pulled into the idea of building/saving/restoring something, as I get a good amount of satisfaction out of making things better.

As much as I'd really like to replace my daily F30 with an E39, there's the practical accountant side of my brain that tells me I don't have time to deal with that ownership right now. The F30 is fast, reliable, and efficient. It's also what pulls me to newer cars like a G20 M340 or G30 M550.

But the F30 is also kinda sterile in the way it drives, and the other side of my brain wants the noises and panache of a well cared for E39 540. I don't know if I need to go to a square setup like I had in my E90, or if it's the x drive, or the electric steering. It's great in a high speed steady state, but unless I'm giving it a full boot it just doesn't rotate, nor does the front end seem to bite all that well.

I decided long ago I'm not going to waste my life driving cars I don't love. Too much time is spent in the car.

... the F30 is, bar none, the worst BMW I have driven. Would not take for free, other than to immediately flip it.

[tnord]

I decided long ago I'm not going to waste my life driving cars I don't love. Too much time is spent in the car.

... the F30 is, bar none, the worst BMW I have driven. Would not take for free, other than to immediately flip it.

HA! I wouldn't go that far, the engine and transmission are great. I think mine in particular also looks really good (Esortil Blue II). I make not-infrequent trips across a couple hundred miles of two lane highways and it's great in that scenario. Great mileage and with the tune multi-semi passes are no problem. I have snow tires for it so with x-drive there's nothing stopping me from getting kids to practice in the winter either.

But yeah, I don't know that I've ever really loved this chassis. However, I don't think I could take a well cared for E39 and drive it through the winter. I would have no problem doing that with a M340 or M550 though. But again, that's a modern chassis I'm not sure I'd really "love" either.

[Obioban]

HA! I wouldn't go that far, the engine and transmission are great. I think mine in particular also looks really good (Esortil Blue II). I make not-infrequent trips across a couple hundred miles of two lane highways and it's great in that scenario. Great mileage and with the tune multi-semi passes are no problem. I have snow tires for it so with x-drive there's nothing stopping me from getting kids to practice in the winter either.

But yeah, I don't know that I've ever really loved this chassis. However, I don't think I could take a well cared for E39 and drive it through the winter. I would have no problem doing that with a M340 or M550 though. But again, that's a modern chassis I'm not sure I'd really "love" either.

Sorry, couldn't hear you over saying WHEEEEEEE

Or, more directly addressing your statement...

[tnord]

you make a good point.