Timing s54 after vanos rebuild installation

[sapote]

That instruction is the final step after all 6 hub bolts are torqued so the cam should not turn independently. It should not cause tears.

Try it hard with the 24mm wrench standing next to the right fender for more leverage. Cams linked to crank not directly but via a few components: splines, hubs, radial roller bearing, pistons, cam sprocket, chain, chain guides, crank sprocket, crank lock pin. Total 9 parts. Are you saying there is zero clearance total between all 9 parts? I'm not talking about permanently shifting position, but it would slightly moved from it TDC if enough torque applied to the cam by 24mm wrench. Just enough for the pin to not line up to cam holes.

[eacmen]

Looking at the photos... Is it me or shouldnt the exhaust hub be horizontal with the floor?


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[avusblue]

I guess I should mention the motor is on an engine stand


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[sapote]

Looking at the photos... Is it me or shouldnt the exhaust hub be horizontal with the floor?


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There is no reason why the EX hub has to be at horizontal or vertical position at this point. It could be installed at any of the 6 possible positions as long as the pump disk is turned and aligned to the hub's 2 tabs.

[JokerElite]

I'm at the end of the VANOS Rattle Procedure guide on Beisan's website. I turned the crank clockwise a couple times to TDC, cams at ~45°, and I used the alignment bridge but the camshaft alignment holes were slightly off.

Now I'm trying to follow their "Adjustment of timing" section and became confused about the step others have mentioned, "Fully retard camshaft timing."

From my understanding, retarding the cams means turning the exhaust cam counter-clockwise until it stops? Is this necessary for my small adjustment?

For reference: http://www.beisansystems.com/procedu..._procedure.htm

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Update: I didn't retard the camshaft any further as the instructions say, "Note: Splined shaft can be seen protruding from sprocket hub front when camshaft is at adjustment end position." This was the case for me. Then I loosened the remaining top 3 mounting bolts on the hubs. Next, I rotated the camshafts at hex until the alignment bridge dowel fit into each camshaft hole. Proceeded to evenly tighten the top 3 mounting bolts on the hubs. Removed the crankshaft locking pin. It then says to turn the crankshaft clockwise until TDC but mine seems to lock up 1/4 way through. Anyone know what's causing this?

[sapote]

I'm at the end of the VANOS Rattle Procedure guide on Beisan's website. I turned the crank clockwise a couple times to TDC, cams at ~45°, and I used the alignment bridge but the camshaft alignment holes were slightly off.

I don't use the Beisan procedure, so did you pretension the hubs with 2 bolts each, then bolting down the vanos module to turn the hubs CCW and then fully bolted down the hubs?

Then I loosened the remaining top 3 mounting bolts on the hubs. Next, I rotated the camshafts at hex until the alignment bridge dowel fit into each camshaft hole. Proceeded to evenly tighten the top 3 mounting bolts on the hubs. Removed the crankshaft locking pin. It then says to turn the crankshaft clockwise until TDC but mine seems to lock up 1/4 way through.

Obviously whenever the hub bolts were loosened and the cams were turned, the engine is out of timing and pistons will hit the valves. To avoid this, the hubs need to be pretensioned and the vanos module is bolted down to the head to rotate the hubs CCW to the precise locations (the correct timing position) then torque down the hubs bolts to lock them at the correct timing position.

Search for my posts on vanos timing and I think it will help you home.

[heinzboehmer]

Yeah, sounds like you're hitting valves. Be careful don't force it.

Like sapote said, you need to remove and reinstall the VANOS unit to achieve proper timing. Basic timing steps follow:

1. Set engine to TDC and lock crank in place
2. Remove VANOS unit and splined shafts
3. Loosen all hub bolts
4. Time camshafts with timing tool
5. Turn hubs fully clockwise and reinstall splined shafts
6. Tighten two opposing hub bolts per cam, then release 90°
7. Bolt VANOS unit back on fully (make sure to align oil pump)
8. Torque all the hub bolts
   • TIS says to use a crowsfoot on a torque wrench for this
   • An alternative is to tighten down all accessible bolts with a wrench (don't break them), remove the VANOS unit, torque with regular socket and then reinstall VANOS unit. Probably wise to save the new gasket for the final install of the unit.

This is by no means a comprehensive timing guide and it's totally possible that I forgot some detail(s). It's best to follow the Beisan instructions or TIS. But the point is that VANOS needs to come off and then go back on to properly time the engine.

[JokerElite]

I don't use the Beisan procedure, so did you pretension the hubs with 2 bolts each, then bolting down the vanos module to turn the hubs CCW and then fully bolted down the hubs?


Obviously whenever the hub bolts were loosened and the cams were turned, the engine is out of timing and pistons will hit the valves. To avoid this, the hubs need to be pretensioned and the vanos module is bolted down to the head to rotate the hubs CCW to the precise locations (the correct timing position) then torque down the hubs bolts to lock them at the correct timing position.

Search for my posts on vanos timing and I think it will help you home.

Correct. I did it exactly as you described and also ensured the splined shafts fit on the easiest/first available hub splines.

It seems Beisan's guide for retiming needs to include removing the VANOS unit to truly "start from scratch".

[JokerElite]

Yeah, sounds like you're hitting valves. Be careful don't force it.

Like sapote said, you need to remove and reinstall the VANOS unit to achieve proper timing. Basic timing steps follow:

1. Set engine to TDC and lock crank in place
2. Remove VANOS unit and splined shafts
3. Loosen all hub bolts
4. Time camshafts with timing tool
5. Turn hubs fully clockwise and reinstall splined shafts
6. Tighten two opposing hub bolts per cam, then release 90°
7. Bolt VANOS unit back on fully (make sure to align oil pump)
8. Torque all the hub bolts
   • TIS says to use a crowsfoot on a torque wrench for this
   • An alternative is to tighten down all accessible bolts with a wrench (don't break them), remove the VANOS unit, torque with regular socket and then reinstall VANOS unit. Probably wise to save the new gasket for the final install of the unit.

This is by no means a comprehensive timing guide and it's totally possible that I forgot some detail(s). It's best to follow the Beisan instructions or TIS. But the point is that VANOS needs to come off and then go back on to properly time the engine.

From my understanding every two rotations to TDC gets the front cams at ~45°. Is that how the cams should be before following this procedure?

Assuming the VANOS unit gasket is one time use correct?

[Cubieman]

From my understanding every two rotations to TDC gets the front cams at ~45°. Is that how the cams should be before following this procedure?

Assuming the VANOS unit gasket is one time use correct?

Yes, your cams make 1/2 revolution for every 1 revolution of the crank.

To set timing you must have TDC 1 (lock pin) and cam ~45° where the front most lobes sort of point at each other.

Beisan method kind of let's you "cheat" if final timing doesn't end up correct. But as others have said you really do need to pull vanos on each timing attempt.

The gasket is one time use however you might be just fine if vanos has been removed once or twice for timing work. Get your timing set up even it takes removing the vanos 10 times, then when you are all done pull vanos away from head and put your new gasket on.

The method of removing vanos and torqing the bolts works well. I used a method that maupineda suggested. You properly torque the bolts w/vanos of and use a pen to mark their location. So you have "torque marks" a mark on the bolt and a mark on the hub. It works, just make sure once you mark a bolt/hole you use that same bolt in the same hole.


I also used a tool that you can put on the torque wrench at a 90°angle that most certainly should get you closer than feeling it out by hand. I used the "torque marks" and when using this tool the marks lined up the same as when I torqued using a standard Socket.

[sapote]

From my understanding every two rotations to TDC gets the front cams at ~45°. Is that how the cams should be before following this procedure?

Not just randomly every 2-turn of the crank (if it was at TDC exhaust stroke then every 2 turns of crank is still wrong in exhaust stroke). Set crank to TDC compression stroke.

[George Hill]

Beisan method kind of let's you "cheat" if final timing doesn't end up correct. But as others have said you really do need to pull vanos on each timing attempt.

Incorrect, as long as the splines shafts were installed correctly you can adjust the timing without pulling the Vanos, this is a BMW approved method. I.E. when checking, the bridges is 2mm above the valve cover surface, loosen the hub bolts rotate the cam and tighten back up then spin the engine and recheck.

[sapote]

Incorrect, as long as the splines shafts were installed correctly you can adjust the timing without pulling the Vanos, this is a BMW approved method. I.E. when checking, the bridges is 2mm above the valve cover surface, loosen the hub bolts rotate the cam and tighten back up then spin the engine and recheck.

For example, checking with bridge pin on EX cam, and the bridge is 2mm above the intake side of the head (cam is too retarded), then I loosen the hub bolts and turn the EX cam CW to get the bridge flat on the head, then torque the hub bolts. But what if the vanos piston was pulled rearward (away form its most forward position) instead of the hub rotated when I tried to rotate the cam CW, then the timing is unchanged and still wrong. No?

The reason is that there are 2 things can move to get the EX cam advance and rotate the bridge CW 2mm: either the hub rotates couple degrees CW with vanos piston unmoved, or vanos piston moves rearward a little with hub unmoved, or both parts move some. There is no guarantee that the hub will rotate CW with the piston locked in place at its most retarded position. If the piston moved from its most forward position, then game is over.

[George Hill]

For example, checking with bridge pin on EX cam, and the bridge is 2mm above the intake side of the head (cam is too retarded), then I loosen the hub bolts and turn the EX cam CW to get the bridge flat on the head, then torque the hub bolts. But what if the vanos piston was pulled rearward (away form its most forward position) instead of the hub rotated when I tried to rotate the cam CW, then the timing is unchanged and still wrong. No?

The reason is that there are 2 things can move to get the EX cam advance and rotate the bridge CW 2mm: either the hub rotates couple degreed CW with vanos piston unmoved, or vanos piston moves rearward a little with hub unmoved, or both parts move some. There is no guarantee that the hub will rotate CW with the piston locked in place at its most retarded position. If the piston moved from its most forward position, then game is over.

I misunderstood what you said. I will pull the BMW repair instructions and OP can make a decision on what is best for their situation.

[Cubieman]

Please show me the documentation that confirms your assertion that what I stated could lead to piston to valve contact.

I believe he meant piston in reference to the vanos piston not being all the way foward and at end of travel in the "cap". Sorry if that didn't make sense as thats likely not proper terminology.