If the RACP is solid, meaning no cracks, would the Mason bar alone be sufficient, or would you still need additional support (CMP/Reddish/Vince)???
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Originally posted by karter16 View PostIf you don't drop the subframe and completely clean the RACP then you don't know for sure if you have cracks or not. Period.
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Here's my front mounts at 92k, without even grinding it down. Suggest watching some reinforcement re-do videos where they cut out the plates from a previous reinforcement and expose the insides (the cavity that gets foamed) and see exactly why this happens lol. When I say I believe every one of these cars has cracks, I think they all have these starter cracks at the spot welds at this age. Unless you got one of them cars with 10 miles on it.
Note: should have color coded these arrows lol. Referring to the right side spot welds in both pics. Both front receivers had cracks, and you can see the really bad spot weld on the passenger side which actually ran up/out the side facing the diff when I ground it down to bare metal.
Remember this every time you see a FS ad that says "no subframe issues" lol. I don't claim to be an expert, just offering my opinion. Like I said, I helped a buddy do the repair and his did NOT pass visual inspection lol. Then I did mine, not expecting it to be as bad but also not expecting it to be flawless. I went with Reddish plates and the Mason X-Brace. All I can say is if you have a shop do it make sure it's one that specializes in this and knows what they're looking for. The big, obvious cracks are easy to spot, but I could see a regular shop easily overlooking all the tiny cracks and just welding plates in over top. Or maybe I'm just projecting because I'm not a professional lol.
Driver Front:
Passenger Front:
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I have a 2005 M3 ZCP and don't know if I have any Subframe cracks or not, but I'm planning on having it reinforced just to be safe. Curious of what is considered the best and strongest method of doing this. I've looked at the Mason Bar and I like the look of it in the Trunk, so I was wondering the advantages or disadvantages of it are compared to a Vincebar or CMP reinforcing kit. With the Mason Bar, does it eliminate having to have the reinforcement plates installed.
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Originally posted by BMWahba View PostVincebar or CMP are the best solutions right now.
I’ve been contacting race shops and other similar fabricators who have the technical know-how. The thing is, it doesn’t require a rocket scientist to understand why these things work.Last edited by aapilcher; 03-24-2020, 08:31 AM.
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Mine did not have any visible damage, nor any "real" damage when I ground it down to bare steel except for a single split spot weld and another spot weld starting to pull ever so slightly. This was just one corner (front, drive). Any vehicle is on the proverbial curve, its just comes down to timing and how rapidly it worsens thereafter. I used Lang Racing's plates and they were excellent, FWIW.'05 M3 Convertible 6MT, CB/Cinnamon, CSL Airbox&Flap, PCSTuning, Beisan, Schrick 288/280, SS V1's & 2.5" System, RE Stg 1&SMF, KW V2, CB PS, Apex EC-7R
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Originally posted by Silbergrau metallic View PostI have a 2005 M3 ZCP and don't know if I have any Subframe cracks or not, but I'm planning on having it reinforced just to be safe. Curious of what is considered the best and strongest method of doing this. I've looked at the Mason Bar and I like the look of it in the Trunk, so I was wondering the advantages or disadvantages of it are compared to a Vincebar or CMP reinforcing kit. With the Mason Bar, does it eliminate having to have the reinforcement plates installed.
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I had this job done about a month ago on my 06' with approximately 104k. I opted for the Redish plates based off of their reputation and quality. I had a local shop perform the job (I don't weld) and replace my rod bearings while everything was off the car. I think the choice of product that you use it is less of a structural integrity issue than an insurance policy. I haven't heard of any RACP failures with a welded vehicle, although I am certain that someone will correct me if I am wrong. That being said, I considered the CMP topside solution and am still looking at it for additional insurance. IMHO ,I would discourage solid bushings, and even super hard delrin bushings when you have them replaced unless the vehicle is exclusively a track or race car, otherwise you will be absolutely punished on the road. The car is significantly tighter after a plate reinforcement and poly bushings. I don't think you can go wrong with any of the choices.2006 ///M3 6MT Coupe Jet Black Track Car
[Karbonius] [MCS 2WNR] [Zionsville] [ [SPAL] [Ground Control] [Beisan] [Rogue Engineering] [Vorshlag] [Redish] [CMP] [Bimmerworld] [Kassel] [TTFS] [Apex] [TMS Sways] [Buildjournal] [Radium] [Ultimate Pedals] [OMP Seats/Harnesses] [UUC SSK] [Custom Cage] [Supersprint] [Carbontastic] [MEC CSL Diffuser] [Trackspec] [Street Faction] [Condor] [Hard Motorsports] [AiM] [Maintenance] [Ask me about products and exact weight of front end components]
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Originally posted by Flat-Six View Post
At this point in time, I do not have any RACP cracks, and I am wondering the same about the (full) MASON Bar....would it alone suffice????
Originally posted by Fresh1179 View PostI had this job done about a month ago on my 06' with approximately 104k. I opted for the Redish plates based off of their reputation and quality. I had a local shop perform the job (I don't weld) and replace my rod bearings while everything was off the car. I think the choice of product that you use it is less of a structural integrity issue than an insurance policy. I haven't heard of any RACP failures with a welded vehicle, although I am certain that someone will correct me if I am wrong. That being said, I considered the CMP topside solution and am still looking at it for additional insurance. IMHO ,I would discourage solid bushings, and even super hard delrin bushings when you have them replaced unless the vehicle is exclusively a track or race car, otherwise you will be absolutely punished on the road. The car is significantly tighter after a plate reinforcement and poly bushings. I don't think you can go wrong with any of the choices.Last edited by timmo; 03-24-2020, 02:19 PM.
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I just finished with my RACP reinforcement with the turner plates installed below and the VinceBar installed above, both epoxied in. When I removed everything and cleaned the underside up, I have 0 cracks and I checked everywhere. I was absolutely amazed how clean the underside was of this car. 105k, Texas car that from what I can tell was never tracked or abused at all since everything is in nice shape.
VinceBar was easy to install and get in, the only trouble I had was all the bushings in the subframe which I did all of. I made a few tools to get them in and out copying the tools that people normally buy but that wasn't too bad. Pretty easy and straighforward install overall tbh. Great to do if you have time and the car isn't a DD. Needed two people to get the subframe back into the car but other than that, it was a 1 man job. Once I get the pics uploaded, I'll post of my before and after process.
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Originally posted by clawhamm3r View Post
That'd be amazing if true, but send me pics of your front mounts and all those little spot welds that have tiny cracks radiating off of them before I believe it. How many miles?
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Originally posted by jowo View Post
Agreed. Anyone know of any trusted shops/mechanics in Canada (particularly west coast) that has done a CMP subframe reinforcement?
turn3autosport did an excellent job on mine. Also Nixon and CG Motorsports are great shops as well, but don’t have first hand experience on subframe reinforcement from those two.
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