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e46 M3 suspension setup, or how to not downgrade your car with suspension mods

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    I should have said that it'll depend on strut. I have MCS and can run anything I want, bottom perch height-wise - plenty of adjustment. On my Bilstein b6 with GC conversion, 7" was 325lb so at 400lb, I would look for 6.25" like tck vvs or a 6" with extended travel like eibach's xt.

    I run tck 400lb which is only in 60mm & it says 6.5" but really is 6.25" tall.
    Last edited by Tbonem3; 02-22-2022, 10:02 PM.
    DD: /// 2011.5 Jerez/bamboo E90 M3 · DCT · Slicktop · Instagram
    /// 2004 Silvergrey M3 · Coupe · 6spd · Slicktop · zero options
    More info: https://nam3forum.com/forums/forum/m...os-supersprint

    Comment


      Originally posted by Tbonem3 View Post
      IMO, using stock mounts defeats a very useful feature of aftermarket coilovers/plates for us - reducing ride height for free through reduction of stack height in camber plates from GC, Vorshlag, TMS and probably others.

      If you just want stock like height (14"+) then you'll have plenty of travel I suppose.
      There's a caveat on this with the Ohlins, isn't there? Hence the need for those 3DM spacers when you shorten the stack height with aftermarket camber plates. I was always under the impression that the R&T struts were designed specifically for stock top mounts, leading to the ride height issues without the strut spacers.
      '03.5 M3 SMG Coupe - Jet Black / Black

      Comment


        Ah ok. I'm not up to speed on the ohlins and that spacer issue. I want as much travel as possible at a pretty low height of like 13.25" so maybe someone like me wouldn't even bother with the spacer.

        Is the concern, without a spacer, that the car would sit too low with aftermarket plates?

        Couldn't you just move the bottom perch upwards to compensate? Droop will be very short, I imagine.
        DD: /// 2011.5 Jerez/bamboo E90 M3 · DCT · Slicktop · Instagram
        /// 2004 Silvergrey M3 · Coupe · 6spd · Slicktop · zero options
        More info: https://nam3forum.com/forums/forum/m...os-supersprint

        Comment


          Originally posted by r4dr View Post

          There's a caveat on this with the Ohlins, isn't there? Hence the need for those 3DM spacers when you shorten the stack height with aftermarket camber plates. I was always under the impression that the R&T struts were designed specifically for stock top mounts, leading to the ride height issues without the strut spacers.
          The strut spacer is the result of the setup being developed with european kingpins and US kingpins being different.

          2005 IR/IR M3 Coupe
          2012 LMB/Black 128i
          2008 Black/Black M5 Sedan

          Comment


            Originally posted by Tbonem3 View Post
            Ah ok. I'm not up to speed on the ohlins and that spacer issue. I want as much travel as possible at a pretty low height of like 13.25" so maybe someone like me wouldn't even bother with the spacer.

            Is the concern, without a spacer, that the car would sit too low with aftermarket plates?

            Couldn't you just move the bottom perch upwards to compensate? Droop will be very short, I imagine.
            The problem is that the Ohlins have very little total travel-- so to have them function properly, you pretty much MUST optimize ride height for bump/droop travel.

            Without the strut spacers on a US spec car, you have to be lower than the suspension geometry is good for. Similarly any camber plate that increases bump travel too much does the same.

            2005 IR/IR M3 Coupe
            2012 LMB/Black 128i
            2008 Black/Black M5 Sedan

            Comment


              Ok so then it does seem that they engineered them for the taller/thicker stock mounts :/

              Too bad stock mounts are as expensive as camber plates these days!
              DD: /// 2011.5 Jerez/bamboo E90 M3 · DCT · Slicktop · Instagram
              /// 2004 Silvergrey M3 · Coupe · 6spd · Slicktop · zero options
              More info: https://nam3forum.com/forums/forum/m...os-supersprint

              Comment


                Originally posted by Obioban View Post

                The strut spacer is the result of the setup being developed with european kingpins and US kingpins being different.
                Euro and US m3s use the same kingpins.
                2003.5 MT JB/B - CSL SCHRICK SUPERSPRINT EISENMANN JRZ SWIFT MILLWAY APR ENDLESS BBS/SSR DREXLER KMP SACHS RECARO AR SLON MKRS GSP DMG KARBONIUS CP AUTOSOLUTIONS KOYO

                Comment


                  Originally posted by jet_dogg View Post

                  Euro and US m3s use the same kingpins.
                  Hmm, seems like you’re right.

                  well, something is different and I forget what, it seems. Whatever it is, the result is that the US cars need the strut spacer and the euro cars don’t.

                  2005 IR/IR M3 Coupe
                  2012 LMB/Black 128i
                  2008 Black/Black M5 Sedan

                  Comment


                    Originally posted by Obioban View Post

                    Hmm, seems like you’re right.

                    well, something is different and I forget what, it seems. Whatever it is, the result is that the US cars need the strut spacer and the euro cars don’t.
                    Yeah weird, Euro car here and with ohlins and GC street camber plates I sit at about 13.25" hub to fender with the right bump/droop without the use of the spacer. When using the spacer it put me further outside of the range. Not sure what else would be different in the geometry though.

                    Comment


                      Originally posted by Obioban View Post

                      Hmm, seems like you’re right.

                      well, something is different and I forget what, it seems. Whatever it is, the result is that the US cars need the strut spacer and the euro cars don’t.
                      Is this true for US cars regardless whether it's using stock top hats or camber plates?
                      '03.5 M3 SMG Coupe - Jet Black / Black

                      Comment


                        For those on a budget, my current setup according to the calculator and butt dyno is flat ride.

                        Bilstein B4
                        Eibach pro kit springs
                        Hotchkis F/R sways medium front, soft rear

                        Great comfort, bumps even with Hankook v12 (awful sidewalls) feel smooth, car turns in very well, and isnt unsettled at motion changes/apex bumps. Couldnt be happier, as it nearly feels my like old MCS setup. Ride height is fixed, but low enough where it looks OE+ but not low enough where its compromising the control arms/bushings.

                        Comment


                          I went with a build directly built by FCM.

                          H&R street coilvers
                          450lb 6" f spring
                          800lbs 6" r spring
                          GC weighted jacks
                          GC front Sway bar stiffest setting
                          OE rear sway bar.

                          Will give some feed back as soon I get everything in and on the car.

                          Comment


                            Originally posted by Chas3n View Post
                            For those on a budget, my current setup according to the calculator and butt dyno is flat ride.

                            Bilstein B4
                            Eibach pro kit springs
                            Hotchkis F/R sways medium front, soft rear

                            Great comfort, bumps even with Hankook v12 (awful sidewalls) feel smooth, car turns in very well, and isnt unsettled at motion changes/apex bumps. Couldnt be happier, as it nearly feels my like old MCS setup. Ride height is fixed, but low enough where it looks OE+ but not low enough where its compromising the control arms/bushings.
                            What are you spring rates? Also, did you measure corner weights?

                            Originally posted by Cronenberged View Post
                            I went with a build directly built by FCM.

                            H&R street coilvers
                            450lb 6" f spring
                            800lbs 6" r spring
                            GC weighted jacks
                            GC front Sway bar stiffest setting
                            OE rear sway bar.

                            Will give some feed back as soon I get everything in and on the car.
                            Also curious if you measured your corner weights before FCM recommended spring rates? Were these spring rates aimed towards a sporty or more race focused setup?
                            2005 BMW M3 ZCP Black/Black - HTE Tuning | Kassel CSL DME | 288/280 Schrick Cams+DLC Followers | Lang Head | Dinan TBs | Bosch 550cc | Radium Fuel System | Karbonious CSL Airbox+OE Snorkel | SS V1 Stepped+Catted Sec 1+Resonated Twin Pipe+Race | 3.91, 3 stage clutch | FCM 400/600 | Vorshlag Camber Plates, RSM | Rogue ASP | AKG FCABs, SFBs | TMS Front Sway, Camber Arms, Monoball RTABs, Pullies | Mason Race Strut + X-Brace | AS 30% SSK | SPAL | Redish Plates | Turbo Toys V2 Hub | WPC Rod Bearings

                            Comment


                              Originally posted by Cronenberged View Post
                              I went with a build directly built by FCM.

                              H&R street coilvers
                              450lb 6" f spring
                              800lbs 6" r spring
                              GC weighted jacks
                              GC front Sway bar stiffest setting
                              OE rear sway bar.

                              Will give some feed back as soon I get everything in and on the car.
                              With those rates it sounds borderline pitchy, and adding GC on full stiff to those front rates sounds very understeery...

                              Did FCM suggest these rates/bar settings? Are you running heavy aero/splitter to counter?

                              Sent from my SM-G950U using Tapatalk


                              Youtube DIYs and more

                              All jobs done as diy - clutch, rod bearings, rear subframe rebush, vanos, headers, cooling, suspension, etc.

                              PM for help in NorCal. Have a lot of specialty tools - vanos, pilot bearing puller, bushing press kit, valve adjustment, fcab, wheel bearing, engine support bar, etc.

                              Comment


                                Originally posted by mrgizmo04 View Post
                                With those rates it sounds borderline pitchy, and adding GC on full stiff to those front rates sounds very understeery...

                                Did FCM suggest these rates/bar settings? Are you running heavy aero/splitter to counter?

                                Sent from my SM-G950U using Tapatalk

                                Per the spreadsheet, those spring rates give you a 1% flat ride.
                                2005 BMW M3 ZCP Black/Black - HTE Tuning | Kassel CSL DME | 288/280 Schrick Cams+DLC Followers | Lang Head | Dinan TBs | Bosch 550cc | Radium Fuel System | Karbonious CSL Airbox+OE Snorkel | SS V1 Stepped+Catted Sec 1+Resonated Twin Pipe+Race | 3.91, 3 stage clutch | FCM 400/600 | Vorshlag Camber Plates, RSM | Rogue ASP | AKG FCABs, SFBs | TMS Front Sway, Camber Arms, Monoball RTABs, Pullies | Mason Race Strut + X-Brace | AS 30% SSK | SPAL | Redish Plates | Turbo Toys V2 Hub | WPC Rod Bearings

                                Comment

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