Dumb Question Thread - No Flaming Allowed

[Acarv_426]

Hey guys,

Here's a dumb question. I'm hearing that the B16 Bilstein B16's are on a 2-7 month backorder. Thinking maybe I should go with the Ohlin's R&T instead of waiting? I'm planning a suspension refresh next month. Coilovers, Front and rear sway bars, adjustable end links, adjustable RCA's, FCA's w bushings, RSM's, camber plates etc - My car is an 03 with 79k original miles. 2nd owner (bought it back in 06) Not tracking, just for street. Maybe overkill, but she's my forever car (had her since I was 19) Thanks in advance.

[IamFODI]

Hey guys,

Here's a dumb question. I'm hearing that the B16 Bilstein B16's are on a 2-7 month backorder. Thinking maybe I should go with the Ohlin's R&T instead of waiting? I'm planning a suspension refresh next month. Coilovers, Front and rear sway bars, adjustable end links, adjustable RCA's, FCA's w bushings, RSM's, camber plates etc - My car is an 03 with 79k original miles. 2nd owner (bought it back in 06) Not tracking, just for street. Maybe overkill, but she's my forever car (had her since I was 19) Thanks in advance.

You can get Öhlins from FCP Euro now. Slam-dunk IMO.

[AWE46M3]

YMMV but this "technique" ruined my good condition visors and left sticker residue all over them. Once the sticker falls apart when peeling, it's nearly impossible to make it look good.

Vert visors don't fit. The best plug and play alternative is vinyl sedan visors with the mirror light. I imagine the adhesive is easier to remove from vinyl as well. E36 coupe visors have the screws and tabs in the correct place but idk about wiring for the lights. All the euro stuff comes without a sticker. I picked up a set on ebay to replace my goo'd ones

I gave this a shot last night and used 91% isopropyl alcohol that came in a spray bottle. It took a few passes and a few different brushes to scrub it out gently but I got it. Sorry to hear the goo gone didn’t work - I was concerned about the oily residue and opted not to go that route. The IPA was tough on the sticker but gentle on the fabric and evaporated quickly once it was done working.

[Acarv_426]

You can get Öhlins from FCP Euro now. Slam-dunk IMO.

Thanks for the reply IamFODI. I think I'll take your advice and go the Öhlins route from FCP.

Any recommendations on the other suspension components such as sways, end links, RCA's etc? I originally intended to go with GroundControl, but I'm not sure. By the way, I just read your suspension review regarding your Öhlins setup with TMS hybrid camber plates. Amazing review!

[Tbonem3]

Thanks for the reply IamFODI. I think I'll take your advice and go the Öhlins route from FCP.

Any recommendations on the other suspension components such as sways, end links, RCA's etc? I originally intended to go with GroundControl, but I'm not sure. By the way, I just read your suspension review regarding your Öhlins setup with TMS hybrid camber plates. Amazing review!

Didn't you just say, above, that you're planning a susp refresh? So whatever parts you already were thinking of like swaybar links, bushings, FCAB, (you don't need new control arms), top mounts or camber plates, but be careful and do your reseach if you want aftermarket paltes - Ohlins don't play nicely with aftermarket camber plates so you need a fix.

The suggestion to get them from FCPeuro is based on the now-removed warranty. You won't get a replcement set for free, if you need one in the future. You'd have to pay the full price (whatever inflation has caused it to rise to, plus tax), then return the old coils (a good $50-100 of shipping), and you'll get the value of the coilovers as store credit which you can use on other, future items. If the program still exists in 5-10 years when you want to do the return.

If you're not dailying the car, I'd just search for the coils from another vendor for a better price. I found a set for $2,550. FCP is $2,690. Will you need to get a new set in only a few eyars? Will FCP still offer their program at all? Just food for thought.

[Acarv_426]

Did you just say you're planning a susp refresh? So whatever parts you already were thinking of like swaybar links, bushings, FCAB, (you don't need new control arms), top mounts or camber plates, but be careful and do your reseach if you want aftermarket paltes - Ohlins don't play nicely with aftermarket camber plates so you need a fix.

Thanks TboneM3. Yeah, I see many people on other forums recommending Vorschlag plates to go along with the Öhlins R&T kit - I came across a few threads in which Obioban had suggested this was not necessarily the case. I’m definitely taking my time and trying to gather as much info on what to piece together. My budget currently sits around 4-5k. Any info I gain from forum forum members is greatly appreciated.

Beautiful M3 btw 🤤

[Tbonem3]

Thanks. I would say it depends on how badly you want to lower the car OR if you want to get softer front springs. I believe the 400lb front springs in the Ohlins kit are too heavy for most people (street car). I would consider getting a pair of hyperco/swift/tck in 6kg/mm (336lb) or 60n/mm (343lb) in 65mm ID or 2.5" Eibachs in 325lb (8") or 350lb (7" tall). and getting street plates from Ground Control or Turner with 2.5" mounts to match Ohlins and the new set of springs. The rears at 630lb are pretty perfect for a street car IMO - track guys are going up to 7/800lb.

The ohilns with stock mounts, at least up front, don't make a lot of sense to me. That's very stiff for a ride height that's not that low. But if you adjust them to the common 13.5" ride height, with how much stack height stock mounts have, surely that can't be much travel, though I suppose you don't need a lot with 400lb rates.

There's a thread about ohlins on the main section or maybe you can ask Obioban or Repoman or MrGizmo who have the experience.

I really like the ohlins kit overall though. There's not a much better kit for the price. Spending similar money on TCK s/a or KWv2/3 or GC d/a or pretty much any other kit doesn't make much sense to me. Then it's a bigger gap to FCM, MCS, JRZ, even TCK d/as are quite a bit more, all added up iirc.

[discoelk]

I gave this a shot last night and used 91% isopropyl alcohol that came in a spray bottle. It took a few passes and a few different brushes to scrub it out gently but I got it. Sorry to hear the goo gone didn’t work - I was concerned about the oily residue and opted not to go that route. The IPA was tough on the sticker but gentle on the fabric and evaporated quickly once it was done working.

No worries. Just a warning for other folks.

[IamFODI]

The suggestion to get them from FCPeuro is based on the now-removed warranty.

It's based on the fact that FCP Euro is, IMO, the best overall vendor for basically everything they sell. Lifetime replacement + excellent customer service.

AFAICT, the only other vendor worth a look in this case is 3DM Motorsport. They work closely with Öhlins USA, including on the development of products for these platforms, and have a lot of capability to advise on and put together individualized setups.

I can see arguments for either of those over the other. What I can't see is foregoing either set of advantages just to save 10% max off the sticker price. Maybe that's just me.

If the program still exists in 5-10 years when you want to do the return.

Have they done anything but grow since they instituted the lifetime guarantee?

[Tbonem3]

They no longer offer free replacement. You must purchase the replacement part. Then they give you store credit to spend on other stuff. I don't know what you want to call it, but it's not warranty replacement. He'd have to pay $3k (likely future price) out of pocket, then return his $2,600 used ohlins, and then have $2600 of store credit to spend on oil filters and sparkplugs I guess. Depends on how much future stuff you'll need. I don't need anything, personally, but others might need a lot.

My greater point is that the constant advice of buying expensive parts from fcpeuro for free replacement is no longer correct to make. It'll depend on the person's desire to have store credit to spend on future items. Before anyone changes the subject, I'm not saying FCP's current incarnation of their warranty program is bad or useless, I'm saying it's not warranty replacement, and it might not be lifetime (the warranty I was sold has been terminated - for the 2nd replacement).

As to your second response - not sure what growth has to do with it. They scaled back the warranty program and broke their original promise despite growing so much from people like me who've spent thousands with them based on that deal that was made when I purchased (2014-2021). I think other, economic factors like inflation would be more at play.

This probably comes across as bitter. Maybe I'm allowed that if you saw my total order amount spent with them. But actually, I'm mostly bothered that they can make this change, but still advertise exactly as before AND, worse to me, the once warranted pronouncement that it's ok to buy expensive parts, cause you can get it from fcp and get an almost free replacement down the line, persists.

We already had a thread about fcp's changes, so I'm not interested in rehashing all that. But I will continue to point out, especially to newer or unaware members, that the benefit of buying from FCP that they surely see mentioned in old threads, and new ones too, is smaller, and worth contemplating more than before.

[IamFODI]

Tbone, the last thing I want to do is imply that you're wrong to be mad. Hope I'm not coming across that way. Apologies if I am.

I agree completely that the recent changes to their guarantee mean it's worth rethinking the value proposition.

Happy to accept whatever terminology you want to use.

My points:

1. Whatever it is that FCP Euro offers, if you buy from any other retailer, you don't even get that. $2600 in FCP Euro store credit isn't anything like an actual free replacement or $2600 in cash, but it's a damn sight more than nothing of any kind, which is what you'd end up with if you buy from anywhere else.

2. About growth: You were expressing doubt as to whether the program would be around in the future. Makes sense given what you've pointed out. I'm offering the counterpoint that they seem to be doing just fine with it overall, adjusting for the predictable hit they took in recent years (as everyone did).

[repoman89]

Barry at 3DM will tell you that despite the 15k mile rebuild interval, these shouldn’t need rebuild or replacement until 100k miles. That’s well over 10 years for most if not all of us. I had mine ordered at FCP but after chatting with Barry for a while and getting at that point an hour worth of setup consultation for free, I canceled and ordered through him. In ten years or whatever I’ll pay him or whoever the Ohlins USA guy is at that point for a revalve and rebuild.

Since then I had a shop destroy a rear adjuster by reinstalling it wrong after installing my Turner RTABs (right after I installed them perfectly as an unpaid amateur ..). Called him up and had a replacement adjuster on its way from Sweden shortly. Not an easy part to find without that guy.

[Tbonem3]

FCP is still one of the best around, and will make sense to a lot of people. But we'll think harder about when and if we'll need to replace things or not down the line. And for most of us, the E46 m3 is no longer a daily, so the future replacement is very far away on a lot of parts. It helps that FCP's prices have lowered, probably to say competitive, esp with ECS. There were times, even with the free replacement pre 2022, where the FCP cost was wayyy higher than ECS or whoever else.``

[IamFODI]

Barry at 3DM will tell you that despite the 15k mile rebuild interval, these shouldn’t need rebuild or replacement until 100k miles.

Heard that from him as well. Crossed my fingers and took the plunge. >42k awful street miles and 9 track days later, zero perceptible degradation.

[PSUEng]

FCP is still one of the best around, and will make sense to a lot of people. But we'll think harder about when and if we'll need to replace things or not down the line. And for most of us, the E46 m3 is no longer a daily, so the future replacement is very far away on a lot of parts. It helps that FCP's prices have lowered, probably to say competitive, esp with ECS. There were times, even with the free replacement pre 2022, where the FCP cost was wayyy higher than ECS or whoever else.``

I agree. Once a few years ago I inquired to FCP about a price match; they declined on the premise they offer lifetime warranty. Now, I still buy from them, but in some cases, it's making better sense to order from my local dealer since I don't pay shipping. I continue to shop the major online houses, but a good relationship with my parts counter has paid off recently.